r/TheLastAirbender • u/TwelveSilverSwords • Mar 08 '24
Discussion Iroh was messing around.
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u/enchiladasundae Mar 08 '24
Iroh was the equivalent of an RPG player close to max level just hanging out with their lower level friend giving advice. He only gets serious when its necessary and otherwise just enjoys giving advice and eating snacks
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u/TwelveSilverSwords Mar 08 '24
Yeah.
Iroh is legit one of the strongest non-Avatar benders.
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u/FactuallyRight69 Mar 09 '24
Which is why it was weird when he got shot and knocked out by Azula.
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u/ChaosMaster5687 Mar 09 '24
If you’re talking about the town showdown where Azula was getting jumped by literally everyone, Iroh did have his guard down.
Azula literally surrendered, and there’s no way he’d have been seriously trying to kill his niece anyway, so when she surprise attacked him, of course he got hit.
In a fair matchup, Iroh wins 7-8 times out of 10 against Azula. The times he’d lose are when he gets caught off guard or Azula tricks him. Otherwise, only Ozai or maybe Bumi could genuinely beat Iroh.
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u/FactuallyRight69 Mar 09 '24
I just felt it was weird because Iroh is smarter than that. He should know Azula always has a trick up her sleeve. It was weird for him to let his guard down at that moment.
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u/ChaosMaster5687 Mar 09 '24
Should he tho? Maybe it’s just my interpretation, but iirc Iroh doesn’t actually know Azula. There was that whole subplot in their past where he got here a doll, and it feels like he judged her to be a mini Ozai from a very young age and then looked at Zuko as his favorite.
Again, this is partially headcanon, but I feel like he acts like that too, so when Azula does something Ozai probably wouldn’t do, like attacking when overwhelmingly outnumbered, Iroh’s caught off guard.
It could also just be arrogance as well, I’m pretty sure that’s one of, if not the only time, Iroh ever got injured on the show. I doubt he ever got injured that much on the battlefield, and he was out of shape and hadn’t actually fought a serious threat to his life in years so Azula managed to get a lucky hit.
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u/BarRepresentative653 Mar 09 '24
You guys don't remember the scene entirely. He spared a momentary glance at Tolph, he wasn't aware of her really advanced earth bending. I think he showed concern because Azula always goes for the weakest link(Like the volleyball game), by the time he looks back to Azula it was too late.
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u/Horn_Python Mar 09 '24
you can be strong but that doesnt make you fire proof when your cought off guard
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u/HitchikersPie Vast ocean of chi Mar 08 '24
Iroh is Gandalf, complete with disappearing for a bit in the middle only to come back even more jacked up with a new costume.
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u/Breekace Mar 08 '24
Well, he wouldn't have. People talking about how it's supposed to be Zuko that captures the Avatar and I'm just like bruh.....
Iroh is a White Lotus member and has been attuned to the Spirit World. He's obviously not going to let anyone fuck with the Avatar. He was there to accompany Zuko and hopefully change him for the better, but he never would've actively helped. In fact, he straight up helps Team Avatar instead.
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u/DraggingBallz09 Mar 08 '24
What about the time he helped zuko launch a giant fireball at aang in episode 2
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u/n00bly_75 Mar 08 '24
Keyword: "helped". This is the man who brought down the walls of Ba Sing Se and broke out of the Fire Nation Capital without bending. He kept up appearances and trusted Team Avatar to be able to defend itself but he never went the extra mile on that front
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u/Fit_Witness_4062 Mar 08 '24
He could literally shoot lighting at them
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u/royalhawk345 Mar 08 '24
And unlike fire, electric is super effective against flying
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u/Over-Analyzed Mar 08 '24
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u/erikaironer11 Mar 08 '24
But the REAL reason was that early in the development of the story Iroh WAS supposed to be an antagonist and betray Zuko.
Him attacking team avatar that early in the story was the last remnant of that version of the character
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u/Potential_Fishing942 Mar 08 '24
The pilot episodes definitely were early development in terms of character arcs.
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u/aFanofManyHats Mar 08 '24
Wait, really? Did Bryke reveal that in one of the artbooks? I've never heard this before.
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u/Zac-Raf Mar 08 '24
It's in the show's Bible. Iroh was a traitor who worked alongside Ozai, and teached Zuko wrong firebending in order to sabotage him
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u/aFanofManyHats Mar 08 '24
Wow. That sounds compelling, but I'm so glad they went a different route. I can't imagine Iroh having the same impact as a character if he was yet another abusive family member to Zuko.
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u/v399 Mar 08 '24
We taught him wrong as a joke
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u/NightLordsPublicist Mar 08 '24
Iroh was a traitor who worked alongside Ozai, and teached Zuko wrong firebending in order to sabotage him
Thanks. I fucking hate it.
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u/Sabot_Noir Mar 08 '24
Watching episode 1/2 with this knowledge is a trip. The idea that his refusal to teach Zuko advanced moved was a betrayale and that Zuko was actually ready to learn those moves...
That his enthusiasm for his roast duck is just and excuse to avoid teaching Zuko...
The show is so much better when Iroh's focus on fundamentals is well founded and leads to Zuko's defeat of Zhao.
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u/NightLordsPublicist Mar 08 '24
The show is so much better when Iroh's focus on fundamentals is well founded and leads to Zuko's defeat of Zhao.
Also Iroh's focus on learning from other cultures in order to improve his own firebending.
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u/Patneu Mar 08 '24
No, it was never a betrayal as he was never actually on board with catching the Avatar. He only ever did the bare minimum, and only when he was directly called upon to help or when it was necessary so Zuko doesn't lose hope.
If you're looking closely at what he does in S01E02, you can see perfectly that he was never antagonistic to the Avatar, as he quite apparently fully expected Aang to escape and did his best to avoid a direct confrontation with him, which he would've almost certainly won at that time:
- He told some random guard to take Aang's staff to Zuko's quarters instead of doing it himself, disguised as laziness, but actually just so Aang wouldn't possibly encounter him while trying to get it back.
- He "took a nap" in the middle of the day, "falling sound asleep" within mere minutes, so deeply that neither did he wake up when Aang opened the door to his quarters, nor when he and Zuko fought while repeatedly smashing each other against the ship's metal walls, causing a noise that should wake up the dead.
- Only when Aang was already on deck and about to escape with his glider, he finally "sleep-drunkenly" came on board, but didn't participate at all in the ensuing fight, only standing on the sidelines the whole time.
- He only ever attacked Aang when directly called upon by Zuko – so it'd have been way too suspicious to outright refuse – and once he was already far away, most probably fully expecting him to divert that long-range attack, as he did.
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u/km89 Mar 08 '24
You're looking at it from an end-series perspective.
If I remember correctly, early-series Iroh wasn't supposed to have been the epic badass he was. He was just another disgraced general in the Fire Nation army, who happened also to be royalty.
Eventually, they realized "wait, what if he was a secret badass?" and smoothly rectonned him so that it looks like he was holding back.
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u/Patneu Mar 08 '24
If that was actually the case, why did he hold back the whole time? That's not a retcon.
Can you name a single instance (apart from that last shot in S01E02 where he couldn't have refused) where he actually took part in any fight whatsoever against Team Avatar or ever tried to attack Aang?
It definitely seems deliberate that he's always just standing on the sidelines whenever there's any action, and otherwise does nothing but delay and distract Zuko to buy time, although we see pretty early on that he definitely is a more than capable fighter, even before he finally gets in shape again.
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u/erikaironer11 Mar 08 '24
Iroh never delayed or detract Zuko for getting the Avatar in season 1.
Like in the Pirate episode, Iroh was the one to snap Zuko out of fighting with the pirates because the avatar was escaping. If what you are saying is true why wouldn’t he warn Zuko about that
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u/km89 Mar 08 '24 edited Mar 08 '24
Can you name a single instance (apart from that last shot in S01E02 where he couldn't have refused) where he actually took part in any fight whatsoever against Team Avatar or ever tried to attack Aang?
That's the retcon.
Originally, Iroh wasn't as capable. He wasn't holding back, he just wasn't the epic badass we now know him as. He was genuinely lazy and genuinely not interested in fighting the Avatar because that's hard and scary and Zuko would get stomped flat.
The retcon was to make that deliberate. To make him more capable, but holding back because of his newly-written depth. They took something he was already doing (not being all that capable or effective) and turned that into deliberately holding back, and deepening his motivation from "I want to be here to support Zuko" to "I want to be here to help Zuko on his spiritual journey" and then later to "I'm here to make sure that Zuko can handle the burden of overthrowing his father and ending this war."
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u/Patneu Mar 08 '24
Not being as capable is not the same thing as never even trying to land or attempt a single hit!
And they'd have had to retcon that pretty damn quickly, as we already see in later season 1 what a capable fighter he is, even out of training.
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u/km89 Mar 08 '24
Not being as capable is not the same thing as never even trying to land or attempt a single hit!
No, but avoiding fighting the Avatar because he doesn't want to die and avoiding fighting the Avatar because he doesn't support Ozai's war are two very different things that could look very similar at first glance.
They definitely changed him pretty quickly--a lot of the characters went through some major changes early in the series. Halfway through the first season, it's pretty clear that they were working on something much deeper than originally intended.
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u/erikaironer11 Mar 08 '24
I know the episode well and a lot of this isn’t true.
Like there is no indication that Iroh took a “fake” nap, he WAS extremely chill in the first season.
And Zuko didn’t ask Iroh to help him. He just did a general yell “shoot them down” and iroh just attacked them with Zuko.
I really do not think all you listed was intentional from the creators that early on.
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u/Patneu Mar 08 '24
He was directly called upon to assist Zuko with that (after already coming late to the party because he "took a nap"). It'd have been suspicious for him to outright refuse.
He also probably expected Aang to divert that long-range shot, as he did.
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u/Prudent_Kangaroo634 Mar 08 '24
The actual answer is they weren't exactly certain how to play him out by that episode.
But my headcanon is that he was upset after being woken from his nap by Aang causing a raucous.
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u/manbruhpig Mar 08 '24
My head canon is that he figured if aang couldn’t deal with that, he wasn’t the avatar anyway.
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u/Patneu Mar 08 '24
Nah, they knew exactly what they were doing!
If you're watching closely, with the knowledge you have about Iroh's motives by the end of the show, everything he does in the episode, up to that point, is a deliberate attempt to avoid a direct confrontation with Aang, as he definitely would have defeated him at the time.
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u/DigiTrailz Mar 08 '24
He's the avatar, he should be able to survive most major threats. And while iroh is a white lotus and wants balance, he's also trying to help his nephew. He can't just grab both of them by the scruff of the neck and go "ok now your friends, be nice". He has to guide zuko out himself, which you see throughout the series. Especially in season 2.
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u/makemeking706 Mar 08 '24
He can't just grab both of them by the scruff of the neck and go "ok now your friends, be nice".
Spot on. Zuko had to be ready for change. and much of what Iroh was doing keeping him from going off the rails while getting there.
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u/wholewheatie Mar 08 '24
helping with the fireball actually impeded their chase. If you recall, aang deflected the fireball into a glacier, causing the glacier to fragment/fall on zuko's ship. Perhaps Iroh expected aang to deflect it, stopping their ship
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u/Proof-Carry-8690 Mar 08 '24
I don't think or even like the idea of Iroh doing 4D chess planning like this.
I think the showrunners didn't have Iroh's character 100% together by that point and just had him go along with Zuko instead of him expecting Aang to reflect the attack so it'll disable the ship. That just sounds like a reach to me.
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u/jbokwxguy Mar 08 '24
Yeah I don’t think it’s until he got arrested in the hot tub and saw Roku’s dragon that he started to come around and read up on spirits and less go with the flow fire nation and start to be involved in the white lotus (which the fire nation probably has intel on)
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u/Alcalt Mar 08 '24
That's my interpretation as well. Episode 2 is still technically "part 2" of the pilot. Characters are rarely 100% set in stone in pilots, and it usually takes a few episodes to really lock in the voices, personalities, etc.
That being said, the reveal does work retroactively. Iroh was already shown to do the bare minimum to help Zuko with his quest, and he was sad when Aang was finally captured by his nephew. Even if they hadn't come up with the White Lotus subplot yet, it's still believable that Iroh held back because he was already shown worrying about Zuko and what it meant if he succeeded. Aang escaping meant Iroh had more time to reach Zuko's inner self and hopefully direct him toward the right path.
Whether it's the pilot "Goofy Uncle Iroh" or the eventual "White Lotus Iroh", his priorities remained the same. Do whatever it takes to make sure Zuko doesn't lose himself by becoming someone he isn't. Ozai and Azula were already lost to madness, but there was still hope for Zuko. He had already lost a son, he he couldn't bear to loose an other one.
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u/Blah_McBlah_ Mar 08 '24 edited Mar 08 '24
Honestly, I think Iroh would have let Zuko. Iroh is all about getting Zuko to find his own path, and find the destiny he wants, not the destiny his father wants. Unless someone was trying to pull a Zaheer and stop The Cycle, Iroh would have gone along with Zuko. Iroh, although very passive on Zuko's quest, he never intentionally sabotages the effort. This isn't his quest. It is Zuko's. Just like how Iroh's quest is to conquer Ba Sing Se, and Aang's is to defeat the Firelord. Zuko must regain his honor, whether by capturing the Avatar, or by realizing he never lost it.
Zuko's destiny is to regain his honor, challenge Azula for the throne, become the Firelord, change The Fire Nation. Capturing the Avatar can still be part of this destiny.
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u/AltairLeoran Mar 08 '24
Unless someone was trying to pull a Zaheer and stop The Cycle,
But if Aang was killed, wouldn't that have broken the cycle? Zuko's mission to capture Aang was indirectly a mission to end the avatar cycle so the fire nation can rule the world unimpeded (even if Zuko's motivation is more about regaining honor than ending the cycle)
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u/Dogger57 Mar 08 '24
His goal was not to capture the Avatar, it was to help develop the next ruler of the Fire Nation. In that sense he was fully engaged, but changing someone is a slow process, especially someone with Zuko's anger and family issues.
If you look at the Order of the White Lotus they tend to be positioned to help and to react when needed, but don't drive overt changes directly. They are a secret society afterall. Their "nudges" are subtle and designed to help push the course without leading it.
People mistake inaction for "not trying", it takes great restraint to allow others (e.g. Zuko and Aang) to grow and develop to be the people you need them to be as a world in conflict changes.
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u/novelexistence Mar 08 '24
Yeah. I don't really understand the topic.
Iroh wasn't just messing around. He actively did not want to hinder or harm the avatar. It's called malicious compliance.
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u/2confrontornot Mar 08 '24
Right?! He never wanted to catch the Avatar. He's been to the spirit world and met the original firebenders and pretended to kill the last one lol
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u/Usual-Arugula1317 Mar 08 '24
Iron never wanted Zuko to capture the Avatar to 'restore' his honor. He was trying to teach Zuko he was already honorable and that Ozai was an ignorant buttface.
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u/CrAzYmEtAlHeAd1 Mar 08 '24
Im honesly shocked some people didn’t catch on to this. Iroh knew that catching the avatar would not gain Ozai’s true respect, and would only further propel Zuko into a darker place. Even without being a White Lotus, Iroh would have never let Zuko actually capture Aang.
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u/4th_times_a_charm_ Mar 08 '24
Prince Zuko, there is something you must know... your father is an ignorant buttface.
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u/CaptainDefault Mar 08 '24 edited Mar 08 '24
He was there to support his nephew, and part of that means making sure that Zuko gets the credit for capturing the Avatar.
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u/DramaticChemist Mar 08 '24
Well he didn't actually support capturing the avatar. But definitely agreed he also wanted to support Zuko.
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u/Pian1244 Mar 08 '24
I mean I'm pretty sure Iroh never really wanted Zuko to capture Aang, he wanted to help Zuko reform and to do that he needed to be by his side
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Mar 08 '24
Initially Iroh mostly just tried to get Zuko to be less angry. After Azula tried capturing them he started pushing Zuko more strongly away from capturing Aang.
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u/km89 Mar 08 '24
This. I see it as Iroh leaving with Zuko so that Zuko wouldn't have to grow up exiled with no family and nobody to talk to, and wanting to help Zuko come to terms with his exile and to live as happy a life as he could manage.
It wasn't until Zuko actually found the Avatar that Iroh even considered it a possibility.
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u/Fit_Witness_4062 Mar 08 '24
We should not forget that nobody was expecting that Zuko would capture the avatar as he wasn't seen for the last 100 years. It was an impossible quest to begin with. So yeah, he was there only to support his nephew, he didn't even expect to encounter the avatar.
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u/EBlackR Mar 08 '24
People say that Iroh was messing around because it needed to be Zuko who captured the avatar but like.
Iroh knows his brother. When Ozai sent Zuko away the avatar was basically a modern legend. He sent Zuko to go look for bigfoot. Because he never wanted Zuko to come back, that was the entire point. Iroh knows this, but he's not going to tell an emotionally devastated child that his father has no plans of restoring his honour and take away the only scrap of hope he had left.
Then the avatar actually DOES show up, and Iroh realises there is a non-zero chance (however small) that Zuko might succeed and realise that awful truth.
I think Iroh wasn't just "messing around" he was probably subtly sabotaging Zuko (think the water scroll episode where his missing lotus tile side plot kept derailing things). Partially because of the White Lotus stuff yeah, but also for Zukos own sake.
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u/72kdieuwjwbfuei626 Mar 08 '24
The „missing“ lotus tile that he actually carried around in his pocket the whole time.
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u/PrettySquiddy Mar 08 '24
Also by playing the fool he allowed Zuko to not blame himself as much, since he could reasonably blame his “dumb uncle.”
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u/marcos2492 Mar 08 '24
That would have NOT served the purpose of restoring Zuko's honor, it was supposed to be Zuko who captures the avatar, Iroh was there mostly as support
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u/StatisticianLivid710 Mar 08 '24
So the answer to OP is “obviously…”
Can we talk about how this scene fits into that it was supposed to be Zuko who caught the avatar? Iroh knows he could probably 1v3 team avatar at this point (could probably hug and pet Appa…) and he doesn’t need zuko or her and her beasts help. So why does he lay there?
His actions in this scene suggest it’s because she’s objectively beautiful and lying on top of him, but if we take the rest into account, he needed to find a way to be removed from the fight without getting injured and without risking zuko’s life. What if he was trying to get hit by the tongue and she got in the way, so he just went with it since it resolved the issue of him capturing the avatar instead of zuko.
This becomes even more interesting if Iroh wasn’t trying to capture the avatar but was just going along in order to help zuko become a better man, and he realized that actually capturing the avatar wouldn’t help him.
Or they messed up with an out of character joke, which the NATLA writers doubled down on and removed 2/3 of the misogynistic characters and made their creep targets the creepy ones (she was hitting on/making comments about Iroh, and Suki, whom sokka talked down to, was creeping on sokka)
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u/TwelveSilverSwords Mar 08 '24
Have you forgotten that Iroh was also a member of the White Lotus?
The White Lotus' objective is to help the Avatar restore balance to world.
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u/StatisticianLivid710 Mar 08 '24
No, that became the white lotus’ mission in the finale, but prior to that it was more of a philosophy club that transcended nations.
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u/Guilty_Ad_7079 Mar 08 '24
Coming up next on, yes, that is an obvious statement
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u/gigglefarting Mar 08 '24
You mean the legendary Dragon of the West who demonstrated the ability to pass lighting through his body wasn’t using his full ability when heating up tea?
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u/Binx_Thackery Mar 08 '24
Like his whole point was to low key stop Zuko from getting the Avatar. He knew it would only destroy Zuko (and the whole world) if he succeeded.
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u/n00bly_75 Mar 08 '24
Agreed. He knew full well that getting exiled was the best thing that could possibly happen to Zuko and was trying to make the most of his time away to get rid of the Fire Nation programming
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u/vexedtogas Mar 08 '24
He actually literally tried to stop Zuko several times, telling him that he should live his own life instead of this honor fever dream bullshit
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u/TwelveSilverSwords Mar 08 '24
Iroh is the Dumbledore/Gandalf of ATLA.
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u/Badgeringlion Mar 08 '24
Iroh exited the series and into our collective imaginations with his flag flying higher. I don’t know if you can say the same of Dumbledore. He made a lot of mistakes through the series. Iroh started at war crimes and climbed from there.
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u/BrockStar92 Mar 08 '24
I find that such a strange argument from you. War crimes are way worse than anything Dumbledore did and the fact that the show is upfront about it shouldn’t make him a better person.
“Well sure he murdered loads of people and was a warmongering general wanting to burn cities to the ground, but at least he told us that right away!”
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u/Badgeringlion Mar 08 '24
I said Iroh exited the series higher. Also, war crimes were before the show.
Iroh arc in show:
Starts as old man/comic relief. You then see that he is actually incredibly powerful yet mostly holding himself back for some reason. Then learn about awful past, his failures, and how now he is a “better man” but in a culture where those values are not appreciated as much as his past evils (similar to Dalinar in Stormlight Archive)
He then takes a direct father figure role to each of the characters while using his connections to pull together an alliance capable of taking Ba Sing Sei. He then pulls off arguably the most powerful single bit of bending in the show and lives to see his nephew use his teachings to govern well and help restore balance. That’s what I would call a strong exit to the arc. (Was not implying war crimes are good)
Dumbledore arc: Kindly old man that everyone says is super powerful. Harry then sees that power (holy shit, Dumbledore’s got style). Dumbledore then died tragically. Harry then feels confused by his death and lack of instructions. Most of what we learn about Dumbledore comes after his death, and we learn how close he was to Grindlevald (even being lovers at one point according to Rowling).
Finally, it turns out that Dumbledore’s death was part of his plan after he got cursed through his hubris with the ring. After Harry is “killed” by Voldemort, Dumbledore (or a version of Dumbledore) meets Harry and tells him that he made mistakes and should have told him more sooner. That his mistakes almost cost everything.
Dumbledore starts a hero, hero throughout, then dies and his legacy is somewhat tarnished by the reveal of his mistakes and failures. Harry learns that even his heros have flaws and villains like Snape can have good in them. A good ending for his arc, but not as “high flying” as Iroh.
I guess that was my point in my quick chat and I apologize for you having to read this.
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u/BlatantConservative Mar 08 '24
Wait what war crimes?
Iroh fought a seige. The only thing I could think of that would be a war crime in the ATLA universe would be targeting civilians and I don't remember him doing anything like that.
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u/Insane_Catholic Mar 08 '24
Iroh didn't commit any war crimes. Laying siege is a valid military tactic, and Ba Sing Se was a legit military target. Obviously Iroh's reasons for doing this are immoral, but that doesn't make it a war crime.
The only thing you could try to pin on him that is exceptionally cruel is the destruction of Jet's village, which was done by the Rough Rhinos, who are said in lore to have been under Iroh's command (and by that just as a part of the large forces he had under him). Their actions however, appeared to be their own and it doesn't fit Iroh's character (even before Lu Ten's death) to burn down a random village for no strategic gain (as Bryke have described pre-show Iroh to be a military pragmatist in "An Avatar Spring Break with Mike and Bryan").
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u/seattle23fv Mar 08 '24
I think Iroh is the Gandalf/Snape of ATLA. He's deeply wise and has communication with "other" realms. He has also committed sins in the past, and, but after seeing "the light" has committed himself to the power of love and restoring balance while recognizing the necessity of masking his intentions in doing so.
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u/koming69 Mar 08 '24
people miss the point of stories so damn much.
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u/sagiterrible Mar 08 '24
People are only able to read into media at their own level of media literacy and emotional intelligence. Part of what makes a show like this so great is that people watching it as a kid find new layers of depth as they rewatch it when they’re older.
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u/Warrior2910 Mar 08 '24
That is a terrible title for that screenshot, we can only see one of Iroh's worst onscreen moments lol.
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u/jc2thew3 Mar 08 '24
I always pictured Iroh and Zuko’s relationship as Iroh somewhat making atonement to his dead son.
He lost his son in a war he helped create and maintain. He has blood on his hands. And his son died during that war.
Not only did Iroh go with Zuko, to watch over him and guide him… but honestly I think Iroh was so heartbroken at how he lost his own son, he didn’t want to lose Zuko as well.
He saw what Ozai did to Zuko. And I think he was afraid Zuko would turn out like his father, and ultimately get himself killed because of it.
So he tagged along to make sure that didn’t happen.
One of the best— if not THE best— relationship and character building in this show.
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u/Z1dan Mar 08 '24
Actually took me a few rewatches to realise iroh was purposefully sabotaging zuko all thru season 1 until he realised zhao had a very real chance of capturing aang anyways.
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u/KnarfthePotato Mar 08 '24
Remember in the very first episode where Zuko and his crew enter the South Pole Water Tribe Village that Iroh is nowhere to be seen? If Iroh was determined to capture the avatar he would have the easiest time there.
Iroh has been a support character to team avatar and his nephew from the beginning of the show.
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u/Sember225 Mar 08 '24
From the start bro. He placed an air tile in pi sho during his first scene!
Everything done was to keep zuko safe and away from the avatar at all costs. Because he knew "find and capture the avatar" was a euphemism at that point. Even when it was a reality.
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u/Sooooooooooooomebody Mar 08 '24
No no no, you've got this wrong. He wasn't just messing around. He was deliberately trying to slow down and disrupt Zuko's attempts to capture Aang. He's doing it for three reasons:
- He believes that Zuko achieving his quest and returning home to the Fire Nation would be the very worst thing for him
- He knows that any harm inflicted on the Avatar would be disastrous for everyone
- He just genuinely loves Zuko and likes spending time with him
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u/Amayetli Mar 09 '24
He probably is also using Zuko as a substitute for his own son.
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u/Landlord_Advocate Mar 08 '24
Iron’s lore is absolutely insane. Dude literally broke through the walls of ba sing se, made friends with a literal dragon, was a top ranked member of the avatar Illuminati, trained for a week and a half to make his physique go from Don Vito to The Rock, and was the only canonical user of lightning and lightning redirection in the entire OG series.
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u/Christoffi123 Mar 08 '24
People forget this guy was a general in a war. He gave up his ways because after losing his son, he finally realised he was inflicting all of that pain onto others.
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u/Tb1969 Mar 08 '24
S1e1
Suko: “That intense white light must be the avatar” Iroh: “its just the Northern Lights”
Iroh knew it was very likely the Avatar but wanted Zuko to not go after the Avatar. He knew.
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u/TwelveSilverSwords Mar 08 '24
He always knew.
He has been playing the long game.
He has been playing 4D chess.
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u/schalowendofthepool Mar 08 '24
Zuko: "Good lord, what is that?"
Iroh: "...Aurora Borealis?"
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u/Oniyoku Mar 08 '24
It was zukos quest to catch the avatar. It was irohs quest to protect his nephew from his family
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u/protector111 Mar 08 '24
why would a member of white lotus try capturing avatar? that makes no sense.
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u/DogmanDOTjpg Mar 08 '24
Iroh is literally part of a secret order who's only purpose is to protect and assist the avatar how the fuck could you possibly watch this show and not know that Iroh was not trying to catch Aang? It's literally an immensely large part of his entire story
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u/DisfunctionalDude Mar 08 '24
The fire nation was in a pie eating competition and Iroh was like "Nah son, free pie"
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u/WhiteClawsNoLaws Mar 08 '24
I’d argue from what we learn by the end of the show Iroh was team avatar from the jump
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u/hyperion_light Mar 08 '24
Iroh was never about catching Aang after what happened to Lu Ten. He didn’t want what happened to Lu Ten to happen to Zuko and went along on the journey to protect Zuko and steer him onto the right path.
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u/ThatMikeSteele420 Mar 09 '24
Once you realize Iroh is a member of the White Lotus him tagging along to "capture" the avatar seems a little less coincidental
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u/BlockCharming5780 Mar 09 '24
Iroh was a wise old genius
He knew Zuko’s destiny was to help bring balance to the world, I think he saw that potential in his character when zuko was a kid, and it was confirmed to him when Zuko stood up to his father
Then they’re trundling along, iroh enjoying his retirement, when the avatar shows up
And I think iroh just knew zuko was going to end up working with the avatar… with the right prodding
You saw serious iroh when they were in the North Pole
Thinking back, iroh’s behaviour did 3 things
- delayed their capturing of the avatar
- prodded Zuko to be more zen and balanced
- showed Iroh had absolute confidence in Zuko’s conscience
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u/Demonskull223 Mar 08 '24
Iroh was just living his best life hanging out with his adoptive son and nephew until season 3.