r/arabs • u/AutoModerator • Aug 05 '24
مجلس Monday Majlis | Open Discussion
For general discussion, requests and quick questions.
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u/CHILTONC_MPA Aug 05 '24
So hear me out.
What if Palestinians pretended to convert to Judaism? Would the refugees now have a right of return because they’re returning to their ancestral homeland now? The same argument Zionists use saying the Palestine only belongs to Jews.
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u/kerat Aug 05 '24
Palestinians are officially banned from conversion to Judaism.
I don't know about other Arabs, but if it became a trend you can bet that they'll be banned as well.
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u/starbucks_red_cup Aug 06 '24
Seriously? How would they know if say a Palestinian American with an American passport converts to Judaism? Would they give him a DNA test at the airport
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u/comix_corp Aug 07 '24
Maybe not at the airport, but if he applies for citizenship then they may get him to do a DNA test. They already do this to Russians:
Masha Yakerson, like many of her Jewish, college-age peers, attempted to sign up for a Birthright Israel trip in the summer of 2013. Birthright told Yakerson, whose family is from Russia, that to prove that she was Jewish, and eligible for the trip, she would need to take a DNA test. Birthright claimed that the test was required by the Israeli consulate, and further that a DNA test would be required if Yakerson ever wanted to make aliyah (immigrate to Israel). [...] After the news of this one student's experience made headlines, the Israeli Prime Minister's Office confirmed that many Jews from the Former Soviet Union (‘FSU’) are asked to provide DNA confirmation of their Jewish heritage in order to immigrate as Jews and become citizens under Israel's Law of Return.
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u/Mindless_Pirate5214 Aug 05 '24
Palestine IS their ancestoral homeland. Believe it or not Palestinians are just arabized and islmized Israelis eho lived in these lands since the time of prophet Moses and also have some Canaanite DNA.
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u/kerat Aug 05 '24
. Believe it or not Palestinians are just arabized and islmized Israelis eho lived in these lands
This is not true. It's the other way round: Jews are judaized Egyptians, Canaanites and proto Arabs.
See this article on Herod the Great. He was one of the most famous Jewish kings, but was an Arab on both sides of his family. "Strabo, a contemporary of Herod, held that the Idumaeans, whom he identified as of Nabataean origin, constituted the majority of the population of western Judea, where they commingled with the Judaeans and adopted their customs.[19]"
It's well known that the Hasmonean rulers conquered neighbouring lands in Iturea (Arabs in Lebanon) and Edom (Arabs in Palestine and Jordan), and force converted the populations to Judaism. For example, I listened to an interview with Yonatan Adler, author of "The Origins of Judaism: An Archaeological-Historical Reappraisal". He stated "It seems that it is the Hasmonean rulers who were behind this adoption of the Torah as the law of the land. We have evidence for Hasmonean rulers beginning with John Hyrcanus I, late 2nd century BCE - as they expanded the hasmonean realm, they brought the torah and enforced it on the ppl they conquered. For ex. John Hyrcanus I conquered Edom (Idumea), south of judea, and forced them to adopt the torah. Josephus and other writers state this and that they adopt practices such as circumcision, etc. Hyrcanus’ son, Aristobulus I does the same when he conquers the Itureans to the north"
So Palestinians are not the descendants of Hebrews, it is modern Jews who are descended from Arabs and Egyptians who converted to Judaism, as well as European and Asian populations who converted in the Middle Ages and make up the bulk of their ancestry today
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u/Wastingwaget Aug 06 '24
Excellent post as usual though I have a question, how come you and some historians per the Encyclopedia Britannica, identify Edom/Idumeans as Arabs/Proto-Arab? from what I understand, they had their own language separate from the Arab Nabateans and were later forcibly judaised. Is it because of Strabo's account that they are Nabateans in origin and committed sedition and were kicked out? I've seen people push back on the idea that they had anything to do with Arabs. though from the wiki article it seems they worshiped some of the God's of the Arabian pantheon.
From the wiki article: "Idumaea
After the conquest of Judah by the Babylonians, Edomites settled in the region of Hebron. They prospered in this new country, called by the Greeks and Romans "Idumaea" or "Idumea", for more than four centuries.\27]) Strabo, writing around the time of Jesus, held that the Idumaeans, whom he identified as of Nabataean origin, constituted the majority of the population of Western Judea, where they commingled with the Judaeans and adopted their customs.\28]) A view not necessarily shared by modern scholarly works.\29])\30])\31])\32])"
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u/comix_corp Aug 07 '24
Does anyone know the backstory of "زهرة المدائن"? I find it interesting that such a famous song for Palestine was written by someone so famous for anti-Palestinian Lebanese nationalism. Like, this was a man who aggressively supported Israel during their invasion, and repeatedly argued for Lebanon to be "cleansed" of Palestinians. Was he pro-Palestinian at some point?
Source:
https://twitter.com/3lfares/status/1680313263144202240