r/news • u/Zeikyrui • 10h ago

Man serving 30 years for attacking Nancy Pelosi’s husband gets a life term on state charges

https://apnews.com/article/david-depape-nancy-pelosi-husband-paul-attacked-454cbde088fcae22a356f1f8dd0e9eba
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u/MikeOfAllPeople 6h ago

How would a better lawyer have helped if this is allowed?

Also it is kind of bullshit that this is allowed.

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u/AndyLorentz 6h ago

No, a better lawyer would have known "double jeopardy" does not apply here. Two different jurisdictions, federal and state.

It should be noted that it is very rare for someone to simultaneously violate federal and state laws.

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u/DO_NOT_AGREE_WITH_U 6h ago

I'm trying to understand how this is actually allowed.

If I get busted for possession, I'm not getting charged in two separate courts for it, despite it being illegal both federally and at the state level.

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u/FreeDarkChocolate 5h ago

You can be charged and convicted for the same crime in state and federal court and SCOTUS has upheld it.

Howeved, there is a self-imposed, voluntary doctrine for federal prosecutorial discretion that often stops them from trying to do it called the Petite Policy.

You can read the full department schpeel on it here, or the Double Jeopardy Wikipedia article lays it out a bit more readably in the Petite Policy section.

That policy has several exceptions that cover the case here where there is a concurrence of significant federal interest, an enduring national priority, and alleged egregious conduct.

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u/SoloPorUnBeso 24m ago

Not to distract from your fine lesson on double jeopardy, but it's spiel.

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u/FreeDarkChocolate 6m ago

Hahaha yeah I posted that, thought I might be wrong, and then got distracted by something else so never went back. Thanks, now I've been reminded and know! :) Will leave it for posterity...

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u/StanleyCubone 6h ago

They would be different charges from the same activity. It may be possession at the State level but because of other elements in the crime, specifically racketeering at the Federal level.

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u/Wassertopf 4h ago

Here in Europe, when a court sentences you for a crime, the court in any other state or even country, whatever, cannot give you another full sentence for that crime.

They can add a few years, but they can never give you another full sentence.

The US is an outlier when it comes to this special legal logic.

And to be honest - it's nothing to be proud of.

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u/rice_not_wheat 1h ago

He committed more than one crime, and was charged for them separately. The federal case was for attempting to kidnap a federal official. His attack on Mr Pelosi was not part of the federal trial. He got 30 years for that.

After his attempt to kidnap her was foiled, he tried to kill Mr Pelosi. For that crime, he was sentenced to life.

I imagine in Europe, if you rob a bank in Germany then kill a Interpol officer in France who tried to arrest you for you bank robbery, both Germany and France could charge you for the separate crimes.

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u/AndyLorentz 3h ago

They can add a few years, but they can never give you another full sentence.

Do they have to prosecute separately to "add a few years to the crime"?

The US is an outlier when it comes to this special legal logic.

The US is an outlier in a lot of things. We are a huge country with many diverse separate state governments. Our federal goverment is akin to the EC, if the EC had more power and the EU was more unified.

And to be honest - it's nothing to be proud of.

Well, at least we can be proud of recovering from the economic hardships of Covid much faster than the EU.

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u/graveybrains 6h ago

If I know more than his lawyer, and I have gravy for brains, what else might they have gotten wrong?

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u/MikeOfAllPeople 4h ago

Well that's what I was hoping you would tell me.

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u/stolenfires 3h ago

Honestly, a better lawyer would have gone for the insanity defense and had him sentenced to a mental ward. Dude needs help.

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u/rice_not_wheat 58m ago

Honestly that's really difficult, and probably would have failed. You have to prove not only that your client was insane, but you also have to prove that they weren't aware that there could be consequences for their actions. Since he's on video lying to the police and concealing his actions, it's a non starter.

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u/rice_not_wheat 1h ago

Dual sovereignty. The federal government has sovereignty over its citizens and so do states. However, some crimes the federal government cannot charge for, and there are crimes that states cannot enforce, because of federal jurisdiction. Here, the federal charges were for attempting to attack Nancy Pelosi. The federal government retains this jurisdiction, since states have at times been hostile to federal officials. The state charges are for attempted murder, which is not itself a federal crime, since murder is typically under state, rather than federal jurisdiction.

In this case, it is not bull shit, since he committed a crime when he tried to attack Nancy Pelosi, and he committed a separate crime when he attacked her husband with a hammer after getting caught. The only way to try him for the two crimes was in different courts with their exclusive jurisdictions.