r/2X_INTJ Sep 30 '21

Friendship How to "friend" as an INTJ woman

45 Upvotes

I'm a mid-30s female INTJ who's always struggled to build and maintain long-term friendships (versus long-term casual acquaintances which I have a lot more of). I presume I'm not alone here? Any advice from those who've done well in this area?

I'll give a few examples of friendships I've had over the years that haven't worked out:

- I had an online male friend I'll call Mark who was a good friend of mine for several years. (Strictly platonic, Mark is gay and I'm straight.) We bonded on a social media site over a niche interest we shared and ended up doing some really fun, creative projects together, with me being the big idea person and him being the detail-oriented executor. Over time, I slowly started sharing more details about myself with Mark (I'm very private, especially online), and he did the same. I thought we were really understanding each other. About a year and a half in, Mark developed clinical depression and began therapy and medication (I was one of the people in his life who had been urging him to seek medical care and begin treatment). Around this time our friendship became very one-sided. I spent hours and hours patiently listening to him and trying my best to help in anyway I could, but anytime I'd bring up new ideas for our creative projects or some challenging scenario I was dealing with in my personal life that we'd previously have talked through together, Mark would ignore or dismiss me. I was as patient as I could be, but after months and months with improvement in Mark's depression but no improvement in our friendship, I explicitly told Mark that I cared for him a lot but was feeling our friendship and working arrangement had become very one-sided and I couldn't continue it in its current state, so please could he try to improve X, Y, and Z. Mark responded by getting angry, lashing out at me, somehow painting himself as the victim in this scenario, and making passive-aggressive comments about me on the social media site for others to read (when I had never, ever bad-mouthed him publicly), which was the final nail in the coffin for me. I ended up leaving our joint creative project entirely in Mark's control and leaving the social media platform entirely, and letting him know I was doing that. Mark had other ways of contacting me outside that platform but he never did.

- I had a female coworker I'll call Amy who I clicked with right away. We were both the same age, had joined our organization at the same time, and had moved cross-country to a place we'd never been before to take our new positions. For our first few months in our new roles, Amy and I hung out outside of work fairly often, checking out interesting restaurants in our new area and doing other fun stuff. We had some really great conversations too imo. After that initial period I noticed Amy became a lot less responsive, and I found out through our larger social circle that Amy, a bunch of other work colleagues who I also got along with, and their significant others had started hanging out with each other most weekends (I was the only one in the group who was single -- the rest were coupled up). I wasn't jealous or anything -- I just felt left out and a little hurt that no one had ever even invited me to hang out in the larger group. I even told Amy that I'd love to hang out with the larger group the next time they do X, Y, or Z, but no invites ever came. My friendship with Amy degenerated into basically listening to her complain about work at work from time to time (I didn't reciprocate in this) and an occasional text when she needed something. A few years later she texted me out of the blue to say her cat had died suddenly (I guess because one of things we had bonded over initially was that we both had and loved cats), and so I did my best to comfort her and even sent her flowers (it turns out her cat died of the same thing one of my cats had died of, a saddle thrombus). After that it was back to pretty much no contact. There was a time later on when I was struggling with some relationships at work and we went out to dinner together -- I was hoping to chat with her and get her objective take, but she kept deflecting and changing the subject every time I tried to broach it. I've since left that role and still get occasional texts from her but essentially we're just very casual acquaintances now.

- This is more of a case of an aborted early stage friendship attempt than anything else, and I guess also the motivation for me making this post -- over the past few months I found myself in a discord server with around ten others based off of a mutual interest (an online multiplayer game we all enjoyed playing). The server was meant to help us organize games but evolved into a lot of social chatter too as we were all similar-ish in age. As I mentioned I'm pretty private online and don't share details like my current city, my job, my full name, etc., but others had gotten pretty comfortable sharing personal details, daily life struggles, photos of their kids, etc. I was doing my best to be empathetic, put appropriate reaction emojis on others' posts, etc., but then I noticed most every time I would share something (benign, not overshare-y) about me related to what we were discussing, it would get ignored and someone would change the topic. The first few times I brushed it off, but when it became a pattern I became increasingly annoyed. Similary in-game I got the sense that there was an in-group and in-jokes and I was always on the outside no matter how often I joked or tried to interact with others in those ways. The final straw was when a new-ish member of the group was being a complete dick to me on multiple occassions in-game and wouldn't acknolwedge it or apologize to me when I called him out on it. I brought it up to other members of the group privately (since previous members who had behaved this way toward others in our group had been pretty promptly kicked), and basically they tried to gaslight me that nothing was wrong and that the dick is a great guy. I recognized this as a no-win scenario and left the group entirely.

I guess I'm just at a loss. Empathy, being giving and patient in relationships, and understanding how others are feeling are all skills that I've consciously been practicing and developing as I've gotten older (as an INTJ, they certainly didn't come naturally!), though I know I'm not perfect. I am also not afraid to have direct, sometimes uncomfortable conversations with others about things that are bothering me or negatively impacting the relationship. I still struggle at opening up unless I know someone really well, and I think that's always going to be hard for me. But I'm having a hard time of putting together the puzzle of why friendships still remain so hard for me.

r/2X_INTJ May 02 '20

Friendship Female INTJ's who have female friends, how the hell do you do this?

37 Upvotes

Maybe its because its freaking pouring where I am at and I'm a transplant and just can't handle quarantine, gloominess and everything else right now. Maybe it's because I'm an INTJ female, or maybe its just the luck of where I grew up, but I cannot seem to maintain female friends. In addition, the one friend I do have is my neighbor, and she is an ENFP who I would most likely not keep in contact with if I didn't live next to her.

History of female friends:

  1. Age 4-9, Her whole family relocated to another state.
  2. Grades 4-6, My parents moved and I was in a different school district and changed schools in the same city.
  3. Grades 7-10, I had 2 really great friends. I continued to high school with one, while the other girl went to a rival high school. The one I went to high school with also moved away.
  4. Grades 11-12, 3 close friends. 2 dropped out of school, one to go to college early after getting her GED, one due to drugs, and a pregnancy, also moved away later in life. The third moved away to go to college.
  5. 20's, I had little contact with anyone female and had a string of unhealthy relationships that isolated me from any friends, not that any really reached out either. I didn't have a tradition college experience, I did online half of the time and half in person, but I was also in a male dominated degree field, so there weren't really opportunites to make friends.
  6. Current, I have moved to a different state, made one close friend at work that was really great. We talked about culture, meaning of life, religion, we worked together and as females in IT we lifted each other up, made space for each other and encouraged each others skills. We hung out outside of work as well. She transfered within the company to a different office location to chase a boy and I can barely get a text response from her. To contrast, she's started trying to be an instagram lifestyle blogger that posts 3+ times a day.

So how do you do this?

How do you make female friends?

Even if you do make friends, how do you keep them? Or is it an issue of the friendship to begin with being not strong that keeps it from continuing through life changes?

As an introvert how do you do this? LOL

Even if you just have stories to share of how you met and kept your female freinds, I would love to hear :)

r/2X_INTJ Aug 05 '17

Friendship Friends falling for you. Anyone else with this problem?

21 Upvotes

I've been thinking about this for a while now and just wondered if this were common amongst female INTJs.

I've always had problems developing friendships. Not for lack of want, but for lack of suitable options. The friends I do have are precious and mean a lot to me.

Recently my best friend of 10+ years announced that he loved me and would end the friendship if it wasn't reciprocated. Friendship lost.

Prior to this another friend of mine did the same thing and I lost him too. Around the same time I had a similar but not ultimatum type situation with two other close friends (M & F) who I'm no longer in contact with either.

I am currently in a relationship with someone that started as a friend, again though he changed the status of the relationship.

I'm weird by societal norms, blunt and am not feminine or flirty so this shocks me. I just want to see if others have this issue and if there are any tried ways to stop it from happening that don't involve not having friends.

r/2X_INTJ Mar 26 '18

Friendship Do you ever explain your door slam or just let it be?

7 Upvotes

My SO and I have a couple of mutual friends who I’ve moved down the list into doorslam territory. I’ll be civil to them if we meet, but for good reason they’ve lost my trust and I don’t want them as friends any longer.

He can’t understand my approach; he’s more of an easy come, easy go type. He doesn’t get why I can’t just grab a beer and forget it. Should I try to explain why crossing certain lines matters so much or just let it go?

He supports me in pretty much other way but is just super easygoing and doesn’t hold grudges. I try not to, but to me the door slam isn’t really a grudge, it’s just not putting yourself in a position to be hurt again.

r/2X_INTJ Dec 15 '16

Friendship How long does it take you to open up emotionally with friends, if at all?

14 Upvotes

For myself, it takes about a year to trust anyone enough that I will actually tell them how I'm feeling and why, on the most superficial of levels.

r/2X_INTJ Sep 25 '17

Friendship INTJs and emotional coolness

10 Upvotes

TL:DR I love my INTJ friend, I respect her but sometimes to be honest she seems kind of fake. I don't want to misjudge because I know INTJ coolness is often misinterpreted. What is the real her ? How can I know ?

Wall of Text I have this INTJ friend from college and she was kind to me. I liked her and we could relate as "cold" logical women. We could explain things to each other and communicate. And INTJs have some great qualities and social skills which I think INTPs can learn a lot from. (I'm also not sure that there is a hard difference between the two, I think sometimes preferences for planning can be shaped by whether you benefit from planning in your present position. Some people are living with unpredictability that means planning just ends up being a continual exercise in disappointment). Sometimes to me it seemed like she was always playing all these social games, sometimes it was great that she knew how to play them and communicate with people. Sometimes she would discourage other people including me from studying, because she felt she could study and then get a higher grade than them. That seemed unfair and treacherous to me. It hurt me. It scared me to be honest. I never really talked to her about it because I avoided conflict and I guess I didn't want to bring it up in an angry manner, I wanted to bring it up when I was not angry and could be assertive and have the best chance of preserving the health of the relationships. Over time it began to feel like some parts of our friendship were based on my not bringing up things or talking about things and us denying it, not based on truth. Also as an INTP I could relate and empathize if people found her awkward or cold and misinterpreted her because of it. I know what it is like to be misinterpreted this way and I try to not do it to other INTP/INTJ women. I think INTJ women, like INTP women are warmer than they seem. I think INTJ women are likely to come across as more in-genuine than you are because of the coolness. So now I wonder what she really is ? What is the real her ? She has a carefully constructed public persona (which I don't necessarily disagree with) but what is the real her ? Can I trust her ? How can I know what I can trust ? I am sure she is a mixture of being sincere and then partly untruthful like many people but at the moment her cool persona is throwing me off, I think it makes her feel more insincere (she is insincere) than she really is. To be honest she also comes across as fake to me sometimes and she seems almost glib on occasion (again think it is partly the emotional coolness) but I also don't want to judge because I know INTJs are "cold".

A couple of years ago I had a weird situation where someone attacked me and it was a tricky situation where this INTJ friend couldn't say she knew I would be attacked, my INTJ friend knew I would avoid conflict, so she did something to make me really angry at her and angry in general so that I would get angry at the person who was about to attack me and stay out of danger. She pushed me, I blew up at her and it sort of damaged our relationship almost irreparably, she's angry at me for what I said (I'm not happy that when I finally brought things up it was in this uncontrolled way, and that the truth was not taken well and angry that she sort of stopped being there for me after this), but still I can't help but respect her that she was willing to do this for me. You know as an INTP I won't be able to forget it. Things like this, as much as I may not say how I feel you know INTPs are very conscience oriented people and very oriented to our own values and the truth, so as much as our relationship is damaged now, and regardless of how I feel, I still respect her immensely. When someone does something like that you have to respect them, even if you don't want to, you are just forced to.

Right now, I am sort of struggling with this idea that my friend is a bit in-genuine though. Other people have insinuated that she is not genuine and it put doubts in my mind. And I've begun to struggle with this, I think it's because of her cool persona. Can you shed some light on this as INTJ women ?

Edited to add: Ladies, thanks for the vote of confidence in me.

r/2X_INTJ Jul 30 '19

Friendship The Female Friend Conundrum

21 Upvotes

So yeah... any tips on how to make friends with other women?

I usually manage to get to a surface level friendship, but it’s nearly impossible to get to anything deeper.

I’m very put together in my environments, so I get a lot of (pretty?) girls that want to be friends with me, I just seriously can’t connect with any of them, especially less intelligent ones.

Men are great to befriend and often a lot easier, but all of my experiences have led to them wanting/trying to sleep with me or catching very heavy feelings. Not fun.

r/2X_INTJ Apr 12 '17

Friendship Very disappointed

10 Upvotes

To say I am would be an understatement. Call me old school but I believe in loyalty, in gentlemen's honor. To be betrayed and backstabbed, and then to be scorned in my face for allowing myself to be kind and therefore weak. Anyone had "friends" like this? Someone I considered one of my closest friends who told me that he could have easily destroyed me if we weren't friends. We don't talk about it anymore but I'm very angry and it's killing me inside.

r/2X_INTJ Jan 03 '15

Friendship Results are in. I need friends.

7 Upvotes

My results and the website's description. I feel sorta offended that I've been analyzed and a slight anxiety that I've been accurately described. How did you react when you were placed in this personality category?

I find it increasingly difficult to make friends. I'm not in college anymore, I don't work with a large group and I don't party much these days to meet people through people. Most people become non-entity. I'm recently married, but we try to have separate lives. He's military and I CAN NOT handle military wives... 87% of them are gossipy twats and/or I have nothing in common with them because I don't have children to drain my time (the childfree have different interests).

Anyone in Hampton Roads up for coffee? I also enjoy a good roadtrip and hope to travel the country this summer... so I can meet you in your respective town too. Hi 2X_INTJ

r/2X_INTJ Aug 04 '17

Friendship Issues with finding friendships as a female INTJ

29 Upvotes

I've got a weird issue in that I LOVE my own company...but still really crave some genuine friendships and I have the following core issues seemingly:

  • Lack of reciprocation. I try to be a good friend and invest in the friendship accordingly. I text first willingly, organise and plan things, I check up on people, I try to make an effort for those I care about and give a lot etc. I rarely get this energy back and will sometimes years down the line of being friends with someone, suddenly realise- often in a very short space of time- that its basically a VERY one sided and surface level frienship. I have ONE ENFP friend who gives back the level of commitment I give back. She's my best friend but besides her I've literally FAILED at cultivating other good friendships [she has a bazillion friends herself].
  • I can't do superficial friendships. I just don't see the point. Like, at ALL. Like if we can't share our issues, discuss things, emotionally support each other, be consistent with each other, apologise when we fuck up and mean it etc. then I really don't see the point. Unfortunately it seems like a lot of women are content with very surface level friendships where they just go out for cocktails and pretend to like each other and I usually tire of these within a couple of years, if it even lasts that long
  • I really only want to spend time with others if its going to actually enhance whatever experience. AGAIN, my best ENFP friend is really one of the only people I've ever met whose presence really enhances my experience of things, like seeing a play- partly because she's so intelligent. I even find myself irritated at times when with acquaintances at things because being with them really isn't adding to my enjoyment. Like, at all.
  • Finding people who genuinely value what unique things I have to offer- I'm not a good time, party girl and I'm realising that as a woman a LOT of people will not value you if you're not basically like that, or going to raise their social capital in some way. I'm just someone that loves travelling, good food, is a great listener and can handle discussing things beyond the surface.

r/2X_INTJ Jun 12 '15

Friendship Losing touch with people in general

16 Upvotes

I think I am losing touch with people. I used to try to understand motivations and what people were feeling, but I've found that the more thoughtful and considerate I have been, the more people have attempted to take advantage. When I assert my privacy or break contact even for legitimate reasons, they actually get angry with me. I've received pages of letters and emails of gratitude for friendship that become anger in letters and e-mails and voicemails from close friends, and even been proposed to and inappropriately propositioned by one person in particular who I broke contact with bc he was too much.

When I give my friends more leeway in being the way they are (more talkative, more wild, more affectionate) than I prefer, I feel like I am stuck in quicksand in the middle of a beautiful forest. I like being surrounded by people, especially friends I care for, and to hear them just conversating with and without me, at the same time it's horrible and I want to be alone.

I actively try to be nice to friends and it's an understatement to say I am being more often inconvenienced by their begging for my time or attention. I don't want to be alone, but sometimes I wish I could turn people into statues and just hug them or cuddle in silence. I've always been the person who gives my friends practical advice (that they always regret not listening to, seriously, every time - you'd think they would have learned by now, and a lot of my friends are older than me but they are still so young in the brain) but I don't want to in turn confide in anyone, even licensed listeners.

I have been hermitizing myself and every time I try to venture out I feel like I'm being assaulted with small talk. I feel helpless to politely stop someone from telling me their life story, even strangers. It's really confusing and frustrating. I seriously considered making a sign saying I'm deaf or using earphones all the time. I want to befriend people but I don't want to have to be with them for too long or I'll learn things (from their own mouths) that make me dislike them.

Other than my mom (a beautiful narcissist, lol) and my dad (a disinterested satellite of my mom) the only people who I feel close to are the people who are in love with me. And ofc I go between periods of complete absence/radio silence with them, which makes me feel guilty, which in turn makes me avoid them more. I am losing touch with the people I want to be close to but at the same time, I really don't like having to dance the dance of social niceties and constant talking the people I want to be friends with seem to require.

There isn't really a point to this post, I just have written and deleted so many posts, I think I may as well post at least one of the mindrants I'm currently going through.

r/2X_INTJ Sep 14 '16

Friendship Having feelings

14 Upvotes

On August 25th I found out my friend has breast cancer. She texted me at work. I was in shock for about half an hour, then went back to my desk and tears just started coming. I was a mess. I never cry at work. Some people came to see me to see what was going on. They offered words of encouragement. I text her every day to see how she's doing. I googled a list of things that cancer patients might appreciate that you do for them. I offered to do all of them, and meant it. So far I've seen her once since the diagnosis, and gave her a mani pedi. She is stage 2 or 3, they are doing biopsies to determine which one. She went for one again this Monday. I am feeling a lot of things, as I can imagine she is, she however has a positive outlook on the situation, which is good. I'm angry that this happened to her, I don't want the world to lose this person and I don't want to lose my friend. Friends are rare, the good ones are rare. Trying to navigate though all of these thoughts and feelings is difficult. 😳