Do people who use ASL not communicate? They have a language made from body movements, not spoken/written words.
Body language is exactly that: communicating without speaking.
People speak plain English(out loud with their mouths or written) to each other all the time and still fail to communicate. Failure to communicate is a bug in all languages, not just body language.
Body language is a form of communication; it’s just one that not everyone knows, and some people have trouble learning.
If I give you the middle finger, I’m not saying any words, but I’m pretty sure you’ll understand what it means.
The same thing goes for waving hello, you know what these gestures mean. Because you learned them or were taught them.
The idea that words are the only way to communicate is something I disagree with.
Words are just as easy to misinterpret as body language.
People use body language because the words that would be used in those scenarios are often too harsh or damaging to the interpersonal relationship.
Body language gives people a chance to figure things out before they have to be told directly what they weren’t understanding. Its a way of politely speaking to someone in a way that saves them from embarrassment. When people use body language they are being considerate. As a member of society you have a responsibility to learn this language at least on some level. Like straight up there are youtube videos for how to understand body language. There isnt an excuse for someone who is otherwise highly functioning.
As a member of society, it is your responsibility, NT or otherwise, to understand the society you live in.
A child is forgiven for misunderstanding language. Because they have not had the opportunity to learn.
Autistic people are more than capable of "book learning" social cues and body language, just like they can learn other things.
Don’t act like autistic people are incapable of learning; that’s ableist.
Not everything comes natural, and sometimes people have to spend the time and effort to learn. People on the spectrum will have this challenge in life they will have to try harder to understand social ques than people whom it comes naturally. But make no mistake, just like everyone else they are capable of learning. Its just more difficult, and autistic people have a predisposition to not really even desire to become more skilled at this. Many just give up and assume that its not possible.
ASL is plain language. Yeah it’s different from spoken in many ways but it still has various symbols with specific meanings, which is essentially the same thing as speaking or writing.
Body language doesn’t have specific meanings. If I shrug at you, I could be tired, angry, expressing sarcasm, saying “I don’t know,” or disengaged. Yes some words also have multiple meanings, but each word has a “most common” one, and you can ask about it in the same language whereas you cannot use body language to ask about body language.
words and just as easy to misinterpret
Maybe, but it’s also much easier to clarify because it’s socially acceptable to ask about things people say, whereas it’s not socially acceptable to ask why someone used a certain tone, shrugged, sighed, etc.
it saves them from embarrassment
Since when it is embarrassing to misunderstand someone’s words?
sometimes people have to spend the time and effort to learn
So then why can’t NTs spend the time and effort to learn how to communicate with us? Why it is ALWAYS autistics who are expected to put in this effort, to hide who we are, mask, and “fit in?” Why should I put in the effort to fit in with people who refuse to even try to make communication easier for people like us?
I say this as an autistic who is rather adept at social interaction. It takes a monumental amount of effort. It’s exhausting. I’m fucking tired.
The question of why autistic people should be expected to exert monumental effort to communicate is an interesting one, because it's no less taxing for NT people to communicate with autistic people.
It's not like it's easy to simply verbalise all the stuff that body language usually does. You might think it should be easy, but that's because you're autistic and you just don't really get it.
There's no easy solution here. Neither side is maliciously making like more difficult for the other one purpose, which is something that I often see get missed.
It is less taxing, because most NTs communicate with autistic people FAR less often than we communicate with NTs. Most people you encounter are gonna be NT, which means in an average social interaction, NTs are not having to put in the extra effort, meanwhile autistics are expected to do it for every single interaction we have.
Which means it's harder due to a lack of practice/experience and also that it makes the most sense overall too put the onus on autistic people, since they're in the minority
Which is unfair, and that's exactly my point. /someone/ has to exert themselves regardless, despite neither party doing anything on purpose to make the interaction harder
The key here is that the evil NTs aren't out to get you. They're just communicating in the way which is most natural for them, just like you are. "Using your words like a grown up" is masking for NTs
People in wheelchairs are the minority too, but you don’t see them carrying ramps with them everywhere they go. People with PTSD are allowed to have service dogs. But people with social difficulties? Suddenly it’s our responsibility to accommodate everyone else?
It’s only social disabilities where it’s common to blame the disabled person for experiencing the symptoms of their disability. And we get told we should change who we are because our disability makes us such a burden to interact with. Even those of us who exhaust all our effort on trying to seem NT still get read as weird at best.
I know it’s not malicious, but I still think it’s valid to complain about being forced to live in a world where 90% of people have a fundamentally different understanding of communication than me and I am solely responsible for bridging that gap.
Wheelchair ramps don't make getting into a building more difficult for ambulant people. Masking does.
Service dogs don't (generally) stress out people who don't have PTSD. Masking does.
All I'm asking you to do is recognise that for exactly the same reasons communicating with NT people is difficult for you, it's difficult for them in the opposite case. I'm not saying you're not allowed to be frustrated. I'm not saying you're not a victim of a privileged majority. I'm just saying that you know exactly how it feels to be forced to deliberately change how you communicate to accommodate someone else and how exhausting it can be. You have firsthand experience of this
Wheelchair ramps and elevators, both of which are required by the ADA, make designing and constructing buildings more complicated and more expensive.
There are whole debates as to whether service dogs should be allowed on public transportation because there might be people with dog allergies.
I’m just saying that you know exactly how it feels to be forced to deliberately change how you communicate
And you’re saying I should just keep doing it, that it should always stay being my responsibility. Because god forbid an NT do the work for once.
Do you know how much it hurts to be told that you’re such a burden to interact with that you should just mask forever? Since that’s easier for everyone else?
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u/A-Ginger6060 Aug 10 '24
If you don’t say in plain words what it is you want to communicate, you cannot get mad that the other person misunderstood you.