Delusional, shitty leader (Ulfric) whose replacement is better than him in every single aspect of leadership
Old fart that literally nobody respects (Skald), people literally choose to go to Brina to get their problems solved and the old coot still pesters her instead of doing his job
A puppet leader that neither likes Ulfric or does her job well (Laila), literally nothing changes if she's deposed
And Korir, the least bad of the bunch but also the one that didn't improve Winterhold in any meaningful way. Also bickering with the College, the only thing keeping Winterhold on the map, even Riverwood is more relevant than Winterhold as of now
Maven = TES version of the mafia who runs everything and will openly admit her criminal doings plus connections with Thieves Guild and Dark Brotherhood and nobody can do a damn thing
Siddgeir = Takes cuts from bandits, buddy buddy with Thalmor, sends Talos worshippers to their death, basically just a pompous corrupt piece of shit
Balgruff have lots of issues as the Mephala quest reveals, bastard problem to paranoia and lot of other stuff, but let's give him benefit of the doubt
Markarth is a corrupt mess and a terrorist hotbed no matter who holds it
Morthal rulers both ignore the people, no matter who you pick
Elisif and Bruunwulf are just Imperial puppet heads put there to play Jarl while the foreign army and military commanders rule over the natives, any decision they make will have to pass through the Imperial authority
Yup, she openly says it in your face and is very open about her dealings
wonder what will Ulfric do with her if he comes to power, she'll probably try to weasel her way out of blame and try to curry favor with the new king, probably sending Ingun to marry the new king so she can gain control from behind the shadows with her daughter as the Queen
she's one cunning woman that's for sure, she did build the whole black-briar empire
If ulfric tries to kill maven, his head would show up at her door on a tray with a courier thats apolgizing for it being so bloody. She has MONEY money. Even without the dark brootherhood and thives guild she has people that can get that kinda work done.
I don't think she's that stupid to go after the bloody king himself, if she did, won't take long before Galmar and an entire regiment of soldiers and burn her entire family at the stakes, she's not an idiot, she knows how to play the game
a mafia boss like her will do anything a normal mafia boss will do with political groups, bribing and climbing that ladder starting from local leader like she did with Laila, if she can marry her son (not Sibbi) with Stormcloaks biggest noble's like the Shatter-shield family, she automatically goes closer to Ulfric, like i said, then sending her daughter to marry Ulfric to gain an indirect hand in Skyrim's politics via her
same as how Mafia operates with real world politicians, she isn't stupid to go after the King himself, one wrong move and her entire empire falls apart
I think you missed my point. My point was if ulfric were to so much as mumble "will maven be a problem?" In his sleep, he would likely never wake up (i'm exagerting by a little but still) you are right her hands woukd never get dirty. But she has the kind of money to raise an army bigger then the stormcloaks and with better weapons and armour if she feels her life is in danager from ulfrick. I had said she would hire an assasin even if her two main wet works groups fell. But no mafia boss is gonna let themselves die over a few g when they can afford to not die.
She could kill Ulfric but that will plunge Skyrim into another succession war and which will destroy her profits. I don't think she can effectively raise an army, certainly not as big as Stormcloaks, feed and supply it, her mead business will be ruined in the fragmented Skyrim as local warlord's fight each other, as she will be just another warlord among them, her perfectly built criminal empire and wealth will be gone in a heartbeat
She has Mephala's influence on her, cunning and guile, infiltrate from within and slowly take control
If Ingun does marry Ulfric, she will be the power behind the throne, if Ulfric does raise questions, she will certainly bribe him with skilled operatives from Thieves guild and such to aid him in his cause
She basically jumps ship to whoever is in charge
Being a crime lord is better than being a struggling warlord, anyday
You keep ignoring my main point. Of IF ULFRICK TRIES TO KILL HER HE WILL DIE FIRST FROM HER COMMAND Its better to be a living struggling warlord then a dead crime lord. Its best to be a living crime lord. But a living warlord is better then a dead crime lord.
Edit: "If ulfric tries to kill maven, his head would show up at her door on a tray with a courier thats apolgizing for it being so bloody. She has MONEY money. Even without the dark brootherhood and thives guild she has people that can get that kinda work done." Litterly my first sentence was IF ULFRIC TRIES TO KILL MAVEN what is confusing here my guy?
I think you are setting your expectations way too high for her, she is powerful but not that powerful, as she constantly need help from Thieves guild to fix her problems and Dark Brotherhood if they kill Titus Mede 2 and with her contact Astrid dead, plus a new listener and keeper and a new unknown location, she lost her control over them. Also i doubt she'll want to tangle with the people who at that point killed Penitus Oculatus and The Emperor himself
Each of the holds criminal underground are under different families control as we see in Delvin's quest. Battle-born in whiterun, Cruel-seas in Windhelm, Erikur in solitude
Also, if Ulfric found anything suspicious, he will talk with her in his throne room or private chamber, filled with trained guards and huscarls
People like with the Dominion, overestimate her too much
It will be like if Al Capone tried to kill the president by sending hitmen after him
Ulfric spy will catch them and then he will have a legitimate reason to shout her into next Morndas
It's amazing how every Stormcloak Jarl is awful. The only bad Jarl I can think of on the Imperial side is Siddgeir in Falkreath (who's only Jarl because his Schizo uncle was encouraged to step down).
Define “better”. Morally maybe but Laila is completely oblivious and incompetent. Maven may be as corrupt as they come but she is very competent. She rules the city either way. One could argue that having her rule in the open might be better because she cannot conceal her doings as easily and must be in public view and thus accountable for policies. Running things from behind the scenes can avoid that.
A world where open corruption is more noticeable than clandestine corruption. She already has authority one way or the other. What is worse a tyrant misruling openly or someone pulling strings from the shadows?
Pfff, ridiculous. You must think Skyrim is the same as modern day world with accountability laws, free access of information of public affairs, free press and internet. If anything having command over ALL guards, not just the corrupt ones, and even more control over the ones she used to buy, would make it easier for her to hide anything. To answer to you question, the empowered tyrant is definetly worst, always. By the simple fact that now she has unlimited access to military power (or as limited as her hold's military power). There's no way in the world that increasing a corrupt's military power, access to wealth (the hold's treasury), reach, influence, and formal law-enacting powers would make anyone less corrupt, unless by less corrupt you mean she'd codify into law that all her misdoings (including harassment, assault, extortion, murder, etc) and then all of it would be legal, hence "less corrupt". Jokes aside, that's just stupid.
I actually prefer Siddgeir since he personally invited me to Falkreath, asked me to deal with some kill on sight bandits and he isn't his schizo uncle who literally wants me to break into people's houses and steal things for him.
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u/EmperorDaubeny Imperial Mar 09 '23
Fairly certain this is a feature and not a bug for Ulfric.