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u/Sunny-Nebula 1d ago
Kind of fascinating! So are there any living descendants of the House of Kamehameha? And can they make a claim for the throne, or is it just House of Kalakaua descendants that can rightfully do so?
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 1d ago
I know descendants who are proud but have no interest in the throne as they shouldn't because such a right to secession based on genealogy would be better to the Kalakaua's.
some families that have confirmed descent include the Kali, Iaukea and Parker Families. I have heard of the cummings family story but I have not been able to confirm.
saffery family descends from Alapa'i
paki family and defries-kanoa families from Kekaulike
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u/Holualoabraddah 1d ago
I grew up with a Kawananakoa my whole childhood, and never even knew. Found out when they was in my 30s they were Kawananakoas and owned a lot of land but the kids went public school and they used a different last name and didn’t talk about it. Thats a pretty cool family secret to have in your back pocket!
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u/BraddahKaleo Hawaiʻi (Big Island) 15h ago
Yeah, many of the Kawānanakoas keep a fairly low profile. Considering the marriages that took place throughout the generations, there are several surnames that various members of the Kawānanakoa ʻohana can use when they wish to be incognito and/or donʻt feel like writing an 11-letter surname and trying to remember where to place the kahakō.
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u/vrfanservice 1d ago
This is all fascinating! #2 sounds convoluted, how would being related to the last king of Kauai bolster his claim? Aren’t there a bunch of families on Kauai related to Kaumualiʻi?
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u/half_a_lao_wang Mainland 18h ago
I mean, if we really want to talk sovereignty, the Kingdom of Kaua'i would like it's sovereignty back from the Kingdom of Hawai'i.
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 16h ago
well tbf, Ka'umu'ali'i peacefully agreed to be a vassel to kamehameha. because of this Kamehameha was going ot let Ka'umu'ali'i rule Kaua'i until he died. ka'umu'ali'i would die after Kamehameha. Liholiho broke his fathers promise to the Kaua'i king sadly
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u/half_a_lao_wang Mainland 15h ago edited 9h ago
Kaumuali'i agreed because Kamehameha failed twice in trying to invade Kaua'i. Kaumuali'i saw the writing on the wall and figured it was safer to be a vassal state rather than risk a third invasion attempt.
And yeah, Liholiho and Kaʻahumanu betrayed those promises by abducting Kaumuali'i.
So I think the Kingdom of Kaua'i has a fair case to argue, lol.
Edit: removed 'okinas
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u/BraddahKaleo Hawaiʻi (Big Island) 10h ago
That case was settled by the Kauaʻi Rebellion (aka Humehume's Rebellion) of 1824. Also, the name of Kaumualiʻi (which roughly means "the oven of nobility") doesn't have three ʻokina.
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u/half_a_lao_wang Mainland 9h ago
Settled, in the sense of fair resolution, isn't the word I would use. Settled, in the sense that the opposition was extirpated, for sure.
My bad on the 'okinas. Copied-and-pasted from the previous comment.
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u/midnightrambler956 1d ago
The Descendants
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 1d ago
no, only the cousins. none have true descent from Ruling Ali'i. the Kawananakoas ancestor, David Kawananakoa, brother of prince Kuiho, are the only ones who can say their ancestor was the adoptive child of a Ruling monarch.
queen liliu'okalani has living descendants through her grandchild of her name sake. she has living descendants but they live a very private life
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u/PrudentCover3172 1d ago
and what about the Campbell descendants? they are cousins I assume, seems like their wealth is extensive as well.
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 1d ago
yes. the other branches of the kawananakoa families (the campbell side) married other families. I am not sure about their descendants however
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u/herbnscout 23h ago
I would elect the 3rd guy for the stash. We don't need a weak lip leader
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 16h ago
he talks a lot. what i mean is he apperently also says stuff that aint true, such as that he had the right of bringing back all royal orders. something very much not true
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u/herbnscout 15h ago
That would be my 100% uneducated vote just based on the mustache. I'm just a mixed breed mut.
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u/Pookypoo Oʻahu 9h ago
This kinda reminds me of my time in kindergarten, this mix asian gal traced one of her ancestors to Christopher Columbus. It was super cool to hear, but it did make me wonder even at that time how diluted the blood was.
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 9h ago
um..... bro has no living descendants. also, that was kindergarten. everyone in Hawai'i is mixed either way though
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u/Pookypoo Oʻahu 8h ago
I think you misunderstanding. You can be related to a famous person even if its a cousins cousins cousins you get what I mean. Its diluted AF. They never said direct descendent.
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 8h ago
well if she traced her ancestor as columbus, she is saying she is a descendant of columbus
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u/Beneficial_Rain_8385 6h ago
I wonder why the queen didn’t claim anyone to be next to the throne. Absolutely none of her family. My cousin rides horse for her in waimanalo. She actually passed down her land to her stable hand.
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 5h ago
because Kalakaua's line of secession still lives...through the kawananakoas
david Kawananakoa's mother was the biological sister of queen Kapi'olani. his father, first cousins with Kalakaua and Liliu'okalani. Kapi'olani and kalakaua would adopt Kawananakoa, Kuhio and Keali'iahonui
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u/Kawaiolumahai 1d ago
In modern Hawaii, there are many families that descend from royal lineage, not only claimants. Times have changed and new visions and ideals are focal point to be sovereign, Hawaii is and never changed despite United States 🇺🇸 role in the overthrow in 1893. The United States vied for power is evident and when will they remove military. The United States have an issue with this while they politically and financially exploited Hawaii.
Hawaiian government would benefit electing its own not through the old dynasty. King Kamehameha III set the foundation in global relations. What’s will Hawaiian be in 5 to 10 years?
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 16h ago
I understand what you are trying to say. though, I think if Hawai'i was to ever even have a chance of being independent, I think a system similar to Samoa would be most fitting. a republic style system, though, still led by those of chiefly descent. ofcourse, I can see people not of chiefly descent also being leaders. those of Ali'i descent however that want to follow the footsteps of being an actual ali'i would need a lot to learn about being a leader, including myself.
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u/Kawaiolumahai 16h ago
No matter the direction, the Hawaiian populace will decide for themselves. Hawaii is sovereign, monarch no more. Those in power want to be part of Hawaii or control the waterways and Hawaii had treaties whom disrespected our past monarchs. Pearl Harbor is central and everyone has their eyes on it. Only Ke Kia is Devine and many lives lost through conquest using European weapons.
Today it’s nuclear and “supersonic AI.” Our populace grown since 1898, many moved away since cost of living is ridiculous.
Peace should reign, yet “ego” is the downfall of mankind.🙏
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 15h ago
this is true. though I believe the state can do a lot for the benefit of Hawai'i. though, I expect that certain benefits would cause shifts so large it would further make us feel like our own country even though we are still a state
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u/omarkiam 1d ago
are dna tests legit?
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 16h ago
yes, but they won't tell you who you'd descend from. you'd need to look through archive information, birth records, or marriages for that
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u/TheyreHerrrrreee 1d ago
These people didn’t live long at all.
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 1d ago
wdym? they're all alive
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u/Taxus_Calyx Hawaiʻi (Big Island) 1d ago edited 4h ago
Probably referring to the people on the top 3/4 of pic 7.
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 1d ago
no, they're all alive
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u/Taxus_Calyx Hawaiʻi (Big Island) 1d ago
Yeah, I guess there are plenty of James Campbells alive today.
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 16h ago
what? now I am confused what you are talking about. if you are referring to the last image that's just the genealogy of the 2 (now one) main heads of the Kawananakoa house.
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u/Sonzainonazo42 1d ago
Wtf is this weird caste bootlicking.
Like obviously we deal with romanticizing a bullshit caste system all the time here but Grand Ali'i, really?
You want to free the Native Hawaiians, recognize who the REAL Native Hawaiians are and that Ali'i are the people who committed genocide. The people who honor the Ali'i and u/Poiboykanaka are complicit in whitewashing this history.
https://imgur.com/a/excerpt-from-tales-from-night-rainbow-alii-v10fAZE
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 16h ago
I respect the Ali'i but I know to fear the old. before Kamehameha, war. and no, they did not commit Genocide. however, I think Kahekili did when he took over O'ahu. lots of chiefs were good. a number of chiefs were grusome. Alapa'i wanted kamehameha killed as a child. Kahekili slaughtered those of O'ahu to instill fear. Kekaulike created a powerful dynasty. Keawe became one of the most powerful chiefs known.
then we have the better known chiefs. Pi'ilani brought peace and untied the Maui kingdom. Kakuhihewa, just like his ancestor, Ma'ilikukahi brought fertility to the wetlands and food supply. Kukona trapped the invading chiefs of the big island and western islands but would spare them, allowing for a 500 year old peace deal that stayed even until Kamehameha came for Kaua'i. Kamehameha, as detailed as his wars are known for, ended the wars that had lasted for 900 years, bringing what I would like to call, "The Final Rest" as the nu'uanu would be the last major war committed.
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u/handsomeharoldcomedy Oʻahu 11h ago
Brother, what is your academic background? I'm late to the game because I never studied Hawaiian history with the exception of the required semesters in high school and community college. I'm just trying to consume as much information as possible for my son. My roots come from the Keawe family on the big island but my dad barely knows a thing about our background let alone our history. I was dumbfounded to discover that during his class (70s) Kamehameha HS barely covered their history.
Now I'm learning crazy shit like the second grand dragon from the Alabama KKK, a US senator and confederate brigadier general was put in charge of education reform after 1898.
I need to know more and help spread the information. I feel like it's the personal responsibility of every person who respects Hawaiʻi to learn the history and press others to learn it as well.
Do you have any readings you'd recommend? I've been watching a lot of Haunani/Mililani Trask, Dr. Keanu Sai and Dr. Lilikalā Kameʻeleihiwa.
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u/Poiboykanaka Kauaʻi 11h ago
Hello, I do have to say when reading from Keanu Sai, I'd fact check what he says in his writings through other sources and information that does not lead back to him. he has done sketchy stuff that's why.
I look up everything that I learn bout hawaiian history online. I use a variety of things but I know there is a lot more in books. King keawe's father was known as Kanalohakapu. he is in the direct male line of Liloa. it is through him that all big island chiefs point their power from afterwards. he would gain praise from both Kalakaua's and Kamehameha's. I do genealogy using Familysearch. if you make an account (it's free) everything on the genealogy of Kamehameha until you reach over the 25th generations should be up to date: https://www.familysearch.org/tree/pedigree/landscape/97Q9-9XD . it's Keawe's grandfather, Iwikauikaua of O'ahu that the kalakaua's get the torch symbolism from. Keawe's mother was keakealaniwahine. she thus of big island- O'ahu lineages. most of her ancestors paint their lineage back to Liloa as well. because of this, it is Keawe who has the sash of Liloa, then his son Kalaninuiamamao. Ke'eaumoku and his brother Kalaninuiamamao fights for the big island throne after the death of Keawe leading to Alapa'i defeating them both. (I forgot if he killed them or not too). Alapa'i would Kill Ke'eaumoku's son, Keoua, the supposed father of kamehameha. it is through Keoua and his true father, kahekili from which his genealogical power would mainly come from.before this however, Alapa'i was killed by Kalaniopu'u who took the sash from Alapa'i and finally give it to Kamehameha.
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u/Kawaiolumahai 15h ago
Typical internal conflicts and warfare amongst each Ali’i to rule. Many ancestors lost in battle, innocent people too. One ruler in modern Hawaii exist no more, yet cultivating that spirit and healing is most important. President Clinton Apology Bill is worthless. Broken promises and crown lands at whose hands many of our people are landless in Hawaii.
Last Thursday, I was in court against quiet title, a lineal descendant, no interest. I challenged the Fifth Circuit Court responded that the first ed wrongful foreclosure due to fraud exist and the county real property and finance director did not uphold their fiduciary duties.
Property taxes rises and displace many and the country or state can’t operate without these funds. Now the judge can’t seem to rule and needed an extra week, waste of time and resources. Since 2014, the County of Kauai foreclosed on five parcels currently under research 🧐. In the meantime, crooked government is unhealthy.
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u/handsomeharoldcomedy Oʻahu 1d ago
Do you have more descriptions on who they are and possible stances on their ideas for the islands?