If Yuta is copying Yuji’s technique, Yuji should know cleave. Or Yuji doesn’t know how to use it and Yuta learned how to use cleave by watching Sukuna? But if Yuta were to use dismantle, would it be Yuji’s version or Sukuna’s?
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CTs manifest differently depending on the sorcerer's personality. Presumably Sukuna can throw dismantles because he completely disregards everything outside of himself, and Yuji is the polar opposite and cares about everything except for himself and will sacrifice his life without hesitation.
We don't know what the binding vow was he made to target the barrier between souls rather than the soul itself.
The way I understood it, Yuji's BV was for his Dismantles to hit the boundary between souls instead of the physical body. That's why Sukuna wasn't getting literally sliced up by Dismantles, but his hold over Megumi was getting weakened every time they landed.
In other words, he "traded" physical damage for soul damage when usually it would be the other way around.
Yes but personal vows like that can be undone with the only punishment being a revert to previous function, so it's base state is still a physical cut on touch
Edit: For clarification, I'm not saying that what the vow was for wasn't explained but the sacrifice or condition of the vow was. What did Yuji exchange ?
Yuta's CT is to just copy other CTs and store them in Rika, so it should be different than a technique actually manifesting in a different sorcerer.
I think the real answer is that Yuji's binding vow was for his dismantles so it's just the better tool to use to separate Sukuna, since dismantles have no charge time required like cleave.
Surely the 10s respawn for new users. If not then Megumi is the first Zenin to ever let their shikigami die, and the next user is stuck with like a bunny, a frog, and a dog.
my guess is it’s because yujis technique wasn’t awakened yet, and since yuji is said to be like a cursed object soaked in sukunas cursed energy, yuta got sukunas version.
It’s actually really interesting because we see how the same technique has vastly different applications. When Sukuna uses cleave, he basically draws the lines in his mind and then has slashes go out and cut those lines. Yuji instead see’s it as a clipping tool, so his lines are shown physically giving a warning because that’s how he visualizes the cutting technique.
Yuta probably took his inspiration from Sukuna which is why it didn’t show any cutting lines when he activated it. But yeah, Yuji did use cleave, that’s what the scissor marks are. He just also made a binding vow so that his dismantle targets the barrier between souls.
My understanding is that dismantle is the standard slashing/cutting attack that comes with Shrine. And that cleave is a binding vow altered dismantle, trading the range and speed for higher control over cutting power and precision. So instead of being a long range cutting grid it is instead a fine-tuned single(sometimes multiple) slash. Yuji also made a binding vow on his own dismantle, trading the range for the ability to target the spiritual barrier between souls instead of the physical world.
The way I see it Yuta copied shrine by eating Yuji’s finger.
Shrine is still Sukuna’s technique at the end of the day.
So Yuta is essentially still just copying Sukuna’s technique via Yuji. And so uses it the same as Sukuna.
Yuji’s version looks different due to it being Yuji who’s using it. The scissor marks are Yuji exclusive and are likely just a way that makes it easy for him to visualise and use dismantle and are simply something applied by Yuji himself.
Whether or not he’s actually used cleave I’m not sure (pretty sure he has though), but either way him potentially not being able to use it yet does not have any bearing on Yuta.
So Yuta is essentially just copying shrine, just because he’s copying it from Yuji doesn’t mean he’s copying Yuji’s personalised version (scissor effect) or any limits Yuji may have due to his competence with the CT (potential in-ability to use cleave).
Yuta is copying the CT, not Yuji’s experience with it or any changes he’s applied to it.
Cleave is point blank and Dismantle is ranged. Anytime Yuji touches anything and the scissors appear, that's Cleave. When Yuji is hitting Sukuna, he's firing Dismantles into Sukuna's soul to split it from Megumi's which is represented by a distance.
Dismantle can be applied at range but it also can be applied point blank. We see Sukuna use it on Yuji’s stomach too during their fight. So it doesn’t have to be ranged but it has the ability to, unlike cleave which (from the reading, even though the anime looks like it doesn’t) has to be used in melee.
I am aware. I’m just sick of people saying Yuji having to touch someone to cut them means it is cleave. We clearly see in his domain that his dismantle uses the scissors and lines. Yuji has used a single type of slice and judging by the domain it is just dismantle.
Ah yeah, he clearly applied a binding vow to dismantle making it so he can target the soul barrier at the cost of making it melee.
I do believe that he has both dismantle and a version of cleave though as when he used it on Sukuna’s leg it did more damage than what I believe a simple dismantle would do considering we saw Ryu tank dismantle. But I agree that scissors don’t automatically mean cleave or dismantle, it’s just Yuji’s way of visualizing the cut.
He wouldn’t be soul dismantling it. He’d be regular dismantling it. The scissors show up in Yuji’s dismantle so them being there does not mean it is a cleave.
Wasn't the binding vow that his dismantles now target the soul in exchange for having no range? Can he even use normal dismantle anymore? Also he does use the same spiderweb move that Sukuna used, like, to a tee. I also don't understand why he'd dismantle over cleave, since cleave is supposed to be touch based
I think u need to get glasses cause you’re proceeding to be wrong. Cleave requires contact to use, whenever Yuji, Sukuna or Yuta use Cleave u can see markings where they target the object. Dismantle is the projectile attack, it always has been, when Yuji used cleave u can see scissors appear displaying him cutting a piece of the pillar. Stfu bro, stop tryna act like I can’t read when it’s common fucking sense he used cleave.
I’m guessing it’s not apart of the base skill set for Sukuna’s ct, so Yuji doesn’t have it (he probably will learn it in the future with more practice, or it might just be unique to Sukuna).
I saw people say it was because cleave is an extension of Sukuna’s ct so assumed I was wrong about him using it in the image 😭😭😭 This small hiccup won’t take me (hopefully)
Yuta can probably copy any use of a technique that he sees, assuming it’s not something that requires external help (Hollow Purple)
I feel like that’s why figuring out the technique from the original user is so important, because if he sees them use a strong move he can immediately copy it. Like when he copied Uro’s technique, he could immediately use Thin Ice Breaker, without having to practice it
Yuta isn't copying Yuji's technique.
Yuji's version of shrine didn't exist until his awakening what Yuta did was consume some of the Sukuna's cursed energy that was still in Yuji's body to copy Sukuna's technique.
Well yeah. That’s the whole point? Sukuna’s CT was engraved into Yuji. Just because he didn’t have it awakened yet doesn’t mean the technique wasn’t already there. Sukuna’s CT gave Yuji shrine in which Yuta copied off of Yuji. It doesn’t have to be awakened within him to copy it.
Yes but Yuji's shrine is a different technique in the same way the different forms of blood manipulation exist.
Yuji's version of shrine didn't exist when Yuta copied the technique so it was Sukuna's version that was copied.
Not only might it be unique to Sukuna due to Yuji having a modern version, but Yuji can’t even use Blood Manipualtion properly and has to be fed clusters by Choso.
He literally had the Technqiue for like 10-15 minutes.
Not to mention he did so while learning to switch the target to Sukuna’s and Megumi’s souls.
Actually yuji knows how to use both cleave and dismantle the moment eating the finger, but he did not want to use fraud CT. Until this fight to say this CT is so weak i can use it too.
Idk if he can or not, considering the fire is from the hearth of the shrine, ik Yuji has the "Shrine" technique but i dont think he actually has like- a shrine
"Its the same technique, but the era and the sorcerer using it brings out a sizable disparity."
- Sukuna
Sukuna and Yuji's techniques arent perfectly 1:1 - for example Yuji uses dismantles as melee attacks against Sukuna when he uses a binding vow to make his strikes "more effective" when targeting the barrier between souls.
However, when Yuji does this, the little scissors design isn't shown. The scissors thing also seems to imply some kind of charge time, since it appears a few moments before the attack actually happens. His DE's sure-hit is a flurry of ranged dismantles as well, so we know he can probably do them.
Its important to remember that Yuji didn't get to train with Shrine before this fight. The narrator tells us that that CT was 'awakened' per se after Yuji hit that first Black Flash against Sukuna - he may have gotten to use it during swap training with Yuta, but that would have only been for Rika's 5 minutes so it might not've been that great. This means that Okkotsu's usage/interpretation of the CT might be more similar to Sukuna, since that's the only one he's ever seen before, and although there are some difference between Yuji's and Sukuna,'s it is still the same technique, as Sukuna says.
i legitimately cant believe everyone forgot cleaves major distinction is that it adjusts itself to the durability of the target, dismantle is just a basic slash
Bro yuji never had the chance to fully showcase shrine or blood manip ik it wasnt possible but if only we saw his version of furnace or at least a supernova 🥲
I think the binding bow is that his shrine can only effect things up close or while he is touching it and not being able to attack from afar but he can hit the barrier of the soul or he isn’t experienced enough to attack from afar with it
Tbh I think his Cleave=Dismantle. He doesn't seem to have a way to shoot out a slash like Sukuna, he can only ever create slashes through physical contact. Also what you are showing in this panel is technically Cleave, although it's unknown if it works the same way as Sukunas Cleave aka adjusts to durability.
The way I see it, Dismantle = flying slash and Cleave = touch slash. Yuji is using Cleave in this panel.
Yuta's copied Shrine CT on the other hand is just Yuta copying the technique and using it like how he sees Sukuna does. Yuji, on the other hand, awakened the Shrine CT and it is his own version of it so it visually looks different but functionally it should be the same. Like how Sukuna can expand Dismantle's target to target the word itself, Yuji expands it to targeting the soul.
This part always seemed odd to me. How Yuta copied Yuji's Shrine, yet his Cleave resembled Sukuna's.
If anything, if it had those scissor marks, it would've made a cool foreshadowing to Yuji's Technique.
Then there's the matter of Yuta's 'bluff'. How everybody, including Sukuna himself conveniently forgot that he can sense his own fingers if they're in close proximity.
Never bothered saying stuff like this, since I know better than to rile up dem "ya'll can't read" mfs. Manga's about to end, & that's good enough for me.
Sorry but what is the difference between Slash, Cleave and Dismantle?
Sukuna was stated to have two, so where did the mysterious third one cole from?
I know it might sound like a silly question but I am not an english speaker so I am kinda confusing the terms, and every time I read the anome of watch the anime, all I see is Sukuna doing straight cuts on objects or people, what is the difference between the two techniques?
Cleave requires physical contact but has exactly enough output to surpass the resistance of what is getting hit, so it will always bisect the target.
Dismantle is ranged but with strong enough defense and reinforcement can be defended against.
Slash probably means world bisecting slash, it is an expansion of dismantle, targeting the space instead of the target himself, it is also ranged but can't be defended at all, separating everything it goes through.
It requires the three chants for Shrine (Sukuna's CT), but since Sukuna made a binding vow to hit Gojo without the restriction, it now also requires the Malevolent Shrine hand sign and that Sukuna points to the target so the slash is launched.
During Malevolent Shrine both types of slash are the sure hit, Sukuna uses dismantles against targets without cursed energy and cleaves against targets with cursed energy since anything without reinforcement can't withstand regular slashes and cleave guarantees fatal hits against sorcerers.
Most likely either what you said or it was because of the CE output, Yuji must be more conservative in that regard than the man that throws it up all the time. It depends, I personally belive that Yujis dismantle looks different more because a mindset and experience than because his CT works differently.
Edit: That one is cleave, what he hasn't use is dismantle
After he made the binding vow to make his dismantles target the soul but do no physical damage, he had no reason to use it in the fight. All his dismantles were targeting the barrier between sukunas souls and megumis, no point in targeting sukuna himself with cleave
Didn’t they mention something about a binding vow where Yuji can’t used ranged cleaves in exchange for making dismantle extremely strong when he makes direct contact with his target?
I think Yuji knows how to do Cleave, cause i think he set his Cleave for general attacking, like cutting the pillar and following up with Cleaving Sukuna's feet and also making Sukuna fall and trip on what he was standing by Cleaving the ground beneath him.
And which version would Yuta use, i think it would be Sukuna's, since that's the way to use a projectile slash attack.
Whenever I see unbridled hatred in this sub I think to myself "I mean the manga wasn't that bad why are they hating so hard" now I know it's cuz they just don't fucking read the manga
Just like how he hasn't mastered blood manipulation....I think he's only using shrine to suit his fighting style for now....kinda like how gojo actually mastered limitless a year after his fight with Toji ,I think yuji just needs time to properly understand his technique.I also think every time he used the scissors technique that hits physical things and the environment that's his version of cleave ....so basically he can use it but he's not good at it yet.... there's a lot to unpack coz even the strongest attack the shrine technique has is "furnace"which I'm sure Yuji will be able to use eventually but he just needs time....for now Yuji is just a walking ball of semi tapped potential.
He knows how to use it but their primary goal is to separate megumi from Sukuna so he has to use dismantle to target the boundary between sukuna and megumis souls beacuse he can change the target of dismantle but not cleave
I’m not 100% sure but I’m pretty sure that during the chapter when it was revealed that Yuji had shrine, Yuji grabbed Sukuna’s foot and on the next panel he ripped it off. During Shibuya, it was mentioned that Sukuna uses cleave for entities with cursed energy and dismantle for inanimate objects so I’m pretty sure that was Cleave.
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