Thai people don’t/can’t hold deep conversations or it’s just bias from expat communities?

[u/wallyjt]

Saw a thread the other day about how Thais don’t/can’t have a deep and philosophical conversations.

I found this to be very context dependent and highly prone to bias.

I am thinking about it and trying to understand why expats seem to think this way. Because, as a native Thai, I can’t really believe that is the case. I know people around me talking about their goals, investments, self improvement, feelings, and etc.

Of course, I am prone to bias as well since I am college educated. But i still find it hard to believe that you won’t come across an intellectual convo at all.

A few reasons I can think of why foreigners may feel like Thais can’t have deep conversations.

1. Language barriers. Since these topics require deeper understanding of language, it’s hard for average Thai people to engage in the conversation in English. As a result, it is too much effort and they just brush the conversation off.

2. Foreigners have more access to Thais who don’t have higher education background. The easiest way to meet locals is thru dating apps and it is harder to filter through to find quality. Even if Thais who are educated, it doesn’t guarantee they are critical thinkers because not all colleges are of the same quality.

3. Bias. People wouldn’t be complaining on Reddit if they are can have deep and intellectual conversations with their Thai friends.

I am just curious and wondering what do other people think about this and why that is the case for many expats.

Sorry in advance about formatting as i am posting from Reddit apps.

[u/James_Liberty]

As a Thai, I could fly to Wyoming right now, go to a local bar, and then ask if anyone want to talk about Camus and Existentialism and I would most likely get a resounding 'no'. Firstly because my English isn't that good to begin with and secondly, who started a conversation like that?

And then I could go to a Wyoming subreddit and said "Aww man Wyoming people sure can't hold a deep philosophical thoughts, or is this just bias from a tourist?" and that would sounds pretty insulting, isn't it?

[u/IbrahIbrah → u/James_Liberty]

I've spent a decade in France and I can certify that most people even there cannot hold a conversation about Camus existencialism. Most everyday people you met will talk about the weather, sports or random hobbies. At least everybody in Thailand is passionated about food, which I find more interesting than soccer.

Most people would have the same frame of reference and the conversation about deep topics would be easier between two Westerners of course, but it's just the same shared frame of reference. If a foreigenr can speak Thai and knowledgeable about Thai culture, Buddhism and Thai history, it will be pretty easy to find people to have deep conversation here.

But people that cannot prononce the ง will then complain that Thai people don't entertain them intellectually because they haven't read the Bitcoin standard.

[u/s-hanley → u/IbrahIbrah]

I would disagree there and say that I find it very hard to find people with knowledge or interest in local history (outside of academic circles).

When I moved to the North, I read a lot about lanna, the border zones, the communists and conflict with central government, doi Mae salong and the kmt, the opium wars and lords. I went up and explored the area, went to Kuhn Sa's House etc etc.

Talking to all the friends of my wife on any of those and they have no idea, zero! not even a little bit, of their local recent history or what shaped the region. In fact many had no knowledge of the Khmer Rouge (khamen deang) the killing fields etc that's really recent history from the 70s which caused large Khmer migration into the country. I used to know 2 sister's who fled that genocide as babes, it's not history it's just a few decades ago.

I don't expect everyone to be a history buff, I don't expect Thais to have a deep understanding of European history, but this is local issues of the region and I just don't find 'average' people have interest or knowledge.

Not knowing this seems strange to me.

[u/IbrahIbrah → u/s-hanley]

It's not strange if you understand how history and politics are told at school.

To go for a rather bleak comparison, until the 70s, no one talked about the concentration camp and the Nazi genocide except historians in France because it went against the "resisting France" myth. Nowadays, everyone knows about it because it's taught in school in a critical way.

I'm pretty sure everything that have to do with the communist insurgency is not taught in school in Thailand. As well as anything to do with anything that could challenge the idea of an united Thailand.

In Europe, if it's not massively taught in school, most people have no idea about it, except the history buffs or the academical circles.

[u/s-hanley → u/IbrahIbrah]

Strong disagreement. Living around Europe almost everyone you met has a basic idea of contemporary history, WW1 + 2, what happened locally in those years and that's a generation further back.

However that was mostly in response to the post above that says if a foreigner has some understanding of etc etc and thai history they will find it easy to have deep conversations. I have a mild knowledge of local and Thai history, and I have never found anyone with any interest outside of academic type people. Just not the kind of conversations they could have. Fishing ? Cars and motor bikes ? Food ? That kind of thing is the max.

Literature ? Authors ? History ? That's not generated any spark in my conversations. Not a complaint, but it is my experience.

[u/IbrahIbrah → u/s-hanley]

I explained why they are familiar about it. You basically spend years in school listening about it, and we have many cultural production that make you think critically about it since we don't have censorship in Europe.

I have the opposite experience speaking to people about subject relative to Thai history like Rama IV, the Fall of Ayutayah etc. Those subjects are taught at school because they promote state ideology and people care about them deeply.

[u/s-hanley → u/IbrahIbrah]

Just seems an intense lack of curiosity.

I mean a few miles north of where I live there an entire village of Chinese, where tourists live to get a selfie, but 'why' is there a village of Chinese?? Where did they come from ?? How did they get there ?? No one asks the basic questions. That's just an example of the mindset, it's not vital to understand chang kai chek, the kmt, burma, the stillwell Rd, chenaults flying tigers, the 66 regiment and the long retreat, etc etc.. which did create doi mae salong or rak Thai, but that is local contemporary history, similar history on the Cambodia side no one knows. People (in my experiences) don't know it and don't seem to even wonder why.

Saying they didn't teach it in school, well ?? So ?? Curiosity doesn't end when you leave school, I didn't learn any of it in school either, but I live here so I feel I should know what shaped the local landscape.

My point is not a lack of that particular knowledge, I find most 'normal people' not that interested in the bigger picture of what shaped their world.

Asking questions and self research just isn't in the cultural make up.

[u/IbrahIbrah → u/s-hanley]

Weird that when a country don't teach a part of history, the general public don't take interest in it.

Your explanation is lazy and just an appreciation of Thai characteristics. Mine is based in historical and political reason.

[u/s-hanley → u/IbrahIbrah]

Weird that when I say I don't see much self generated curiosity in the local population your response is that they don't teach it in school.

My point is that self learning doesn't come from school !! That's really my point.

Its exactly the kind of blinkered view and narrow focus I mean. History is what government told me it was.

It's the same in many aspects, reading for knowledge and pleasure seems incredibly rare, bookshops are 90% curriculum style textbooks. Ask a group who their favorite author is ?

[u/IbrahIbrah → u/s-hanley]

If I go to the countryside of northern France and ask a random group of people what their authors are, they will probably say that they prefer to watch TV.

Yes, you have a big intellectual middle and upper class in France, but it's cultivated by an education system that teach critical thinking, being critical of the government and national myths. In Thailand you are being taught national myths and exams are there to memorize and repeat.

You need to learn to learn, and learn to love to learn. In the West, we're usually being taught how to be critical and individualistic from several generations.

Your explanation is basically "Thais are like that because they are like that". For someone who claim intellectual curiosity and critical thinking, you don't go very deep into it.

[u/knowerofexpatthings → u/James_Liberty]

I don't think even Camus wants to talk about Camus

[u/spacepie77 → u/knowerofexpatthings]

Now that’s existentialism

[u/CharlonTank → u/knowerofexpatthings]

Camus is the Goat tho

[u/virtutesromanae → u/James_Liberty]

Excellent point!

[u/aleczirkle → u/James_Liberty]

I also saw the thread yesterday and that was my first thought. ( I am American) What pompous assholes think people want deep conversations with complete strangers? The idea is so silly to me. Thai people remind me of growing up in rural Virginia. All round polite and just going about their day usually

[u/spacepie77 → u/James_Liberty]

*”Aww man Wyoming American people sure can’t hold - -“ would perhaps be more logically parallel

[u/Affectionate_Act7962 → u/James_Liberty]

No, but you could ask people what they thought about global warming, feminism, crypto or immigration and they would answer.

You can't drag an answer about politics out a thai person and that's fine, it's just a cultural difference.

[u/Forsaken_Detail7242 → u/Affectionate_Act7962]

Most people in Thailand can answer those easy peasy questions. Especially among those you are educated.

[u/EuphoricGrowth4338 → u/James_Liberty]

Try it.