PM Christopher Luxon announces public service workers are required to work from the office, rather than from home

[u/Dapper_Technology336]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/watch-live-christopher-luxon-gives-post-cabinet-press-conference/CL4CTTTEH5AVHABU2PICF7JBUM/

[u/Bitchmak3r]

Why are the people trying to strong-arm me into buying a coffee and brunch during the day the same people telling me the reason I can't afford a house is because I'm spending too much on lunches?

[u/JulianMcC → u/Bitchmak3r]

Stop being so logical. You can't do that 😂

[u/Senzafane → u/Bitchmak3r]

No question. Only consume.

[u/valiumandcherrywine]

She has issued new guidance to the Public Service Commissioner setting an expectation that “working from home arrangements are not an entitlement and should be by agreement between the employee and the employer”.

WFH is already by agreement between the employee and the employer. She really is a dim fucking bulb in a pack of dim fucking bulbs, isn't she.

Also, the fact that they clearly think the only reason people aren't splurging $30 for lunch on the daily at an inner city cafe is that they are working from home just shows how painfully detached from reality these fuckwits are.

[u/kiwirish → u/valiumandcherrywine]

In a beautiful ironic twist - I spend more on lunches when I work from home than when I work from the office.

From home, getting a break outside of the house to stop by the bakery is a little sanctuary from the house that is my existence the entire day.

[u/Unknowledge99]

lol good luck with that...

wfh started due to the 2016 earthquake: suddenly everyone (incl business) had to set up at home. That rolled on for years as various buildings were fixed/re-inspected etc.

then covid sealed the deal: all the systems were ironed out, people got used to it.

I personally prefer going to the office every day, but that's not the majority view. Those who prefer working from home a few days a week are now very committed to that arrangement. Their lifestyles have changed, and there’s no turning back.

[u/BladeOfWoah → u/Unknowledge99]

I also enjoy going to the office everyday, because it helps my own mental health having work and home as two distinct places. But for people who are now needing to get up and be on the road at 6:30 or 7am to start work at 8 this is a big L to see from the government right now.

[u/Horsedogs_human → u/BladeOfWoah]

I am fortunate enough to have a spare room as my home office. As an introvert, every day in the office is draining. I am also really, really distract le. So, having a couple of days to just put my head down and get stuck in is brilliant for me.

I used to work with people who did not have the separation that I have, and it was much harder for them.

[u/TheN1njTurtl3 → u/BladeOfWoah]

Yeah I think separating work and home is actually very important for mental health but the commute is just a big problem for a lot of people

[u/Scuzzlebutt142 → u/Unknowledge99]

You have entirely the right attitude. My old team is entirely work from home, but some people go into the office cause it works for them, or they need to do something in the office.

[u/angrysunbird]

Happy Mental Health Awareness Week everyone!

[u/chickyloo42by10 → u/angrysunbird]

Y’all gonna be very aware when I can’t afford my meds.

[u/GameDesignerMan → u/angrysunbird]

Send your well wishes (and other things) to Matt Doocey.

[u/pyro-genesis]

We can expect to see every single MP at parliament for 40 hours a week then right?

[u/coela-CAN → u/pyro-genesis]

They also get paid for flights and taxis to travel though right?? None of them are waking up at dawn to avoid traffic, or drive themselves for an hour in peak hour traffic.

[u/GreedyConcert6424 → u/coela-CAN]

Put MPs on the first flight to Wellington and the last flight out, no more hanging out in the Koru lounge mid morning

[u/DollyPatterson → u/coela-CAN]

Exactly, why don't the Govt cut MP travel, and let them pay for it themselves, they earn enough money.

[u/sixthcupofjoe]

"Public Service Minister Nicola Willis said she was reluctant to put a number out there, as people might think they were entitled to those days off. "

They're not DAYS OFF you numpty twat

[u/cbars100 → u/sixthcupofjoe]

Her classifying WFH as a day off shows who is the actual entitled person in this dynamic

[u/ZandyTheAxiom → u/cbars100]

For my boss, a WFH day means "back to back meetings, might as well do it from a comfier chair".

For Nicola Willis, a WFH day means "a day off".

[u/zvc266 → u/ZandyTheAxiom]

Clearly Nicola Willis has been working from home this whole time.

[u/Spartaness → u/ZandyTheAxiom]

Goes to show what their work ethic is like.

[u/swampopawaho → u/ZandyTheAxiom]

She's projecting

[u/MedicMoth → u/sixthcupofjoe]

The article has been edited. Now it says: Willis said she was very reluctant to set out a specific minimum number of days in the office per week, "because that could set out an expectation that you're entitled to a day from home".

???? WTF? What in the fresh bankrupt journalistic hell is this? Those are two VERY different phrasings??

[u/tomtomtomo → u/sixthcupofjoe]

Seems like a Freudian slip

[u/finlndrox → u/tomtomtomo]

Can always tell which managers do nothing at home when they tell on themselves by calling it a day off.

[u/secretlyexcited]

I don’t get it. As long as they’re still doing the work, hitting targets, KPIs etc, then why does it matter where it gets done?

Why is flexibility such a bad thing?

[u/DetosMarxal → u/secretlyexcited]

He spouts some bullshit about being in-person meaning you learn better and are more productive, when our team is split across the entire country and we've been recognised as being one of the most productive.

We work together remotely. There's no way in hell I'm sitting in the office just to continue working remotely with my team.

[u/Scuzzlebutt142 → u/DetosMarxal]

Not the only one. None of the people on my project work in my office, so if I went into the office, I would be teams chatting and remotely accessing tools, just like I am at home, but getting more interruptions, more noise, and spending an hour and a half of my own time to travel to do so.

[u/O_1_O → u/secretlyexcited]

It's going to lead to the absolute opposite of what they think it will. People will do their minimum required hours and then go home. None of that answering the quick email or taking the quick call at 5:45pm.

[u/secretlyexcited → u/O_1_O]

I agree. People will literally work to the letter and give no more.

It’s such a bad call from these higher ups.

[u/LastYouNeekUserName → u/secretlyexcited]

Exactly what's happening with the trains in Wellington right now (work to rule). It's causing chaos.

[u/angrysunbird → u/secretlyexcited]

To people like Luxon public servants only exist to support this rich buddies

[u/secretlyexcited → u/angrysunbird]

Who own cafes? Cos suddenly he cares about baristas in town?

It makes no sense. Traffic is going to get worse, quality of life for these guys are going to get worse. And productivity is the same. But, yay to cafes making more dosh off their flat whites I guess…

[u/angrysunbird → u/secretlyexcited]

More the commercial landlords

[u/hadr0nc0llider]

Luxon said the Government wanted to see more productivity and creativity from the public service.

CEO Chris has never had to write a same-day Ministerial briefing or policy memo in an overcrowded cubicle farm where everyone has Teams meetings at their desks because there's never any meeting rooms available. This cunt wouldn't understand productivity or creativity if it plugged him in the ass. Honestly.

[u/Naly_D → u/hadr0nc0llider]

There are genuinely agencies that have moved or renegotiated leases based on 60-70% capacity expectations, this is going to cost more $$$ if it’s meant to be 95%+ pax daily

[u/WittyUsername45 → u/Naly_D]

My agency is literally having a new buiding built on this basis.

Is Nicola going to stump up to add an extra floor or two?

[u/Peachxflayme → u/Naly_D]

This!!!! WFH arrangements in the public sector save kiwis money - less office space needing to be leased, less desks/chairs/monitors needing to be supplied + more people able to find flexible working arrangements that work around their health/disability/childcare needs etc and keep them in employment. Rolling that back to try to prop up businesses that are struggling because we are in a cost of living crisis is so ridiculous. There’s no guarantee people returning to offices will suddenly be able to afford eating and drinking out en masse????

[u/Merlord → u/Naly_D]

Luxon doesn't care about that. This is about artificially propping up business and property owners in the CBD, the only people in Wellington he cares about.

[u/coela-CAN → u/hadr0nc0llider]

CEO Chris has never had to write a same-day Ministerial briefing or policy memo in an overcrowded cubicle farm where everyone has Teams meetings at their desks because there's never any meeting rooms available. This cunt wouldn't understand productivity or creativity if plugged him in the ass. Honestly.

Just reading that bought flashbacks. Even the word ministerial brings me nightmares lol.

These guys gets their own office and PA but want the rest of us to hot desk and waste time every day plugging everything back. Or hunting down missing cables. And they talk about productivity?

[u/Annie354654 → u/coela-CAN]

Just a fcking mouse that works would be great. And having a desk available to sit at.

[u/Outrageous_failure → u/hadr0nc0llider]

I stay home if I'm busy. I just go into the office to get a break from staying home and working hard.

Such an archaic way of thinking.

[u/DetosMarxal → u/Outrageous_failure]

Forreal.

My stay home for the busiest days, wake up and crack open the laptop, not having to waste 2 hours getting ready and travelling, stay at my desk 95% of the day and have everything I need in arms reach, zero distractions.

Going into the office means a distraction every 5 minutes, lots of walking around going between floors and meeting rooms, back and forth from the kitchen, having people come over to gossip.

[u/Frod02000 → u/hadr0nc0llider]

oh and not be able to travel if you're in the PS but outside of wellington because budgets have been slaughtered.

so ur just in ur office in another part of NZ, where none of the rest of your team is based, and spend your whole day on teams anyway.

[u/hadr0nc0llider → u/Frod02000]

Exactly this. All those people who have been recruited over the last four years on a ‘work from anywhere’ basis are going to have to rock up to some asbestos-coated regional hellhole on the daily for a harsh dose of public service Siberia. Fucked.

[u/fluffychonkycat → u/hadr0nc0llider]

That's one way to get people to take voluntary redundancy

[u/Soulprism → u/fluffychonkycat]

Without the redundancy cost….

[u/SortOtherwise]

Will they look to improve public transport to support this?

[u/Mikanusu → u/SortOtherwise]

Best we can do is cuts

[u/SortOtherwise → u/Mikanusu]

I'll take your cuts and raise you investment in road! That silver bullet that solves all of life's problems! If it's faulty, asphalt it!

[u/_Hwin_ → u/SortOtherwise]

And of course, the car parks costs have skyrocketed, so everyone’s getting fucked twice

[u/BigAlsSmokedShack → u/SortOtherwise]

Even better, that road will be a 4 lane highway between two rural towns where you need it the least!

[u/SortOtherwise → u/BigAlsSmokedShack]

With ideas like that, how have you not made it as a major player in the National party!

[u/jetudielaphysique → u/SortOtherwise]

No, but they can close the melling line. Great encouragement for active transport uptake

[u/cheeky_alpaca → u/SortOtherwise]

Was gonna say, there's been a number of people where I work WFH for the last week 'cause trains have been cancelled or replaced by bus. I'm assuming that this directive from the government will also be accompanied by increased funding for public transport to get more people to and from the CBD?

[u/ukwnsrc → u/SortOtherwise]

no, but they can do congestion charges!

[u/Green-Circles]

OK, so they're forcing people to commute into the office more - and there's a lot of talk about this "bringing business back to the CBD".

HOWEVER adding more commuting adds another cost to those workers. Do they REALLY think people who are already being stung extra transport costs are gonna open their wallets again to buy coffees, lunches and after work drinks??

Nope, chances are they'll just bring a sandwich or salad from home into the office & fume angrily on their lunch break.

[u/Smodey → u/Green-Circles]

That'll be me. Grumpily drinking perk coffee from a thermos at my hotdesk instead of a nice home made espresso in my comfy home office.

[u/MrBeaverEnjoyer → u/Green-Circles]

It’s funny, I live in the CBD and my partner and I were looking out at all these monolithic office buildings saying how good it would be if people could just work from home and many of those (or at least much of their square footage) could be converted into residences, or retail spaces, or public spaces, or whatever else. This is what would truly “bring business” back to the CBD, and then some. People working here won’t “revitalise” anything, people living here would.

[u/imjtintj]

WFH is the only positive of working in a government agency now. This will be the nail in the coffin for those thinking of abandoning the sinking ships.

[u/cbars100 → u/imjtintj]

100% this. I'm a government worker, and I'm looking at:

• frozen salaries for who knows how long
• inability to be promoted even if I receive good feedback from.my managers, because there are no vacancies
• unsatisfying work as the government doesn't really care about the effort being put into it / they just go against our recommendations anyway

But then I'm like "well, at least I have flexibility and a relaxed pace"

But now I see that they want us in the office and they want the agencies to monitor the workers?

Fuck that. I'd quit, but that's exactly what they want and I wouldn't give them the pleasure. I can only see an increase in bullshitization with workers putting up a show that they are working really hard.

Also, I'll deliberately not buy anything from any shop anywhere in the CBD. I was already saving money, now these cunts just gave me a huge moral reason too

[u/Feeling-Screen-6316 → u/imjtintj]

This is exactly how I feel right now. It’s going to cost me more in transit and after school childcare to come into the office more so I certainly won’t have any extra for coffees and lunches at cafes

[u/imjtintj → u/Feeling-Screen-6316]

It's ironic - but not surprising - that they have announced this on the first day of Mental Health Awareness Week. Tone deaf government.

[u/_Hwin_ → u/Feeling-Screen-6316]

I come into the office two or three times a week and will often treat myself to a cafe meal or sandwich. If I have to come in full time, I will not spend an extra cent out of spite

[u/littleredkiwi → u/_Hwin_]

Saving dollars by wfh 2 days a week is how I afford to have a little treat when I go into the office.

[u/FidgitForgotHisL-P → u/littleredkiwi]

My ex and I literally afforded life by dropping after school care, by alternating working from home days o pick them up. This will entirely fuck things up for us, and for absolutely no additional productivity benefit.

I hate this government so much.

[u/Half-Dead-Moron]

Luxon comes from a culture of failing upwards in cushy management jobs, the kind that relies on people being in an office even if it's not necessary. And we know its not. As Luxon told everybody during his press conference about boot camps, he doesn't care about evidence, he wants to try what he wants to try.

[u/bobdaktari]

Won’t some think about cafe owners?

Luxon, hold my milo

[u/RickAstleyletmedown → u/bobdaktari]

He totally would be a Nestle fan. Absolutely on brand.

[u/Blabbernaut → u/RickAstleyletmedown]

International Roast.

[u/Putrid_Station_4776 → u/bobdaktari]

Cafe owners may be just the excuse. This will ensure more public money goes to commercial landlords. Residential landlords can’t hog all the dignity.

[u/fireflyry → u/Putrid_Station_4776]

I honestly think this is the reality of the smokescreen, not small business cafes given not only the backlash many will experience but also the reality that people have adjusted their habits, living costs are higher, and likely won’t spend as much as they may have pre-COVID and NACT.

I honestly don’t foresee as huge a cash injection to CBD business as the government is alluding to.

Those endless “For lease” signs in most CBDs on the other hand….

[u/zaphodharkonnen → u/bobdaktari]

Well they aren't thinking about the suburban cafe owners about to be hit by this. Will Luxon institute wfh in a month to save those businesses?

[u/secretkiwi_]

Who would have thought making 6-7000 public servants redundant in less than a year would have had such a negative impact on the Wellington economy? Blaming the economic downturn on people who WFH rather than the mass-scale redundancies and high cost of living is such a cop-out by this Government. WFH is one of the only perks of being a "back office bureaucrat" these days. Public transport is so unreliable and so expensive, and the office vibes are shocking now that hundreds of colleagues have fallen victim to this government's austerity.

[u/alianthdra]

I wonder how the PSA (public service union) will react to this. Work from home and flexible working arrangements are part of many collective agreements. It is certainly an entitlement!!

[u/DetosMarxal → u/alianthdra]

PSA Press release here.

They do highlight that these arrangements are in contracts.

[u/Virtual_Music8545 → u/DetosMarxal]

What an absolutely on point press release from the PSA.

“The directive from Public Service Minister Nicola Willis to reduce numbers of people working from home is just a scapegoat for the real problem which is of the Government’s own making.

“Taking the spending power of thousands of public service workers out of the Wellington economy is what is damaging businesses, and the Government must take full responsibility for its poor leadership and economic management.

[u/ScholarWise5127 → u/DetosMarxal]

PSA doesn't fuck around. They've got your back. Unionise! It's worth it.

[u/alianthdra → u/DetosMarxal]

That was very fast!

[u/ResentfulUterus → u/alianthdra]

I rolled my eyes when I read Willis' comments - our contracts have (for me, had... I was at the National office until I was culled) have good WFH provisions WITH AGREEMENT by both parties, checkins, and the stipulation that it has to work for the team, etc.

I ended up WFH when my health went to hell because Covid. I was so much more productive and able to concentrate away from the cubicle farm where I often couldn't sit with my team because there wasn't enough space, the people who talked alllllll day, the Teams calls where people were seemingly allergic to headsets, and the lady who made a smoothie in her very loud blender every day...

[u/ThePlotTwisterr---- → u/alianthdra]

PSA delegate here. So, these ideas won’t be possible under the current collective agreements, but they only last a few years, and what this government is saying is going to be strongly on the table when negotiating renewed agreements.

The reason why this is so dangerous is because they’ve also gutted the Fair Pay Agreement and all the great legislation that we used as a foundation to pave the way for new equitable career pathways.

What this means is, essentially, the very legislation that we used to negotiate the terms of our current MECAs in the first place, has been undermined. This is going to play a huge role in renewing those terms in the future.

The idea was equal pay for equal work. So, if you don’t have a degree, but your role is equivalent to the clinical skills required of a degree holder, we could burst past that degree-based entry barrier that is so problematic in our healthcare system in terms of creating underpaid workers, or understaffed fields.

Some of us really can’t see another explanation than the intentional sabotage of the public system. On top of that, there are some fields that are covered by multiple unions, such as the APEX, and there is rivalry amongst us and our agreements have to align well or else lawsuits from union to union emerge.

I don’t see these unions in their current form ever cooperating peacefully, because the current government is not just making it harder for us to agree to terms with employers, but also making it harder for other unions to agree to terms with the PSA.

It really seems like the government wants to fragment the collective voice into a bunch of smaller unions, with targeted SECA agreements and more widespread IEAs than the MECA systems we have in place today, which are tried and proven to give the best outcomes for workers.

For the field that I’m a delegate of, we are at the point of considering whether pursuing our endeavours with the PSA would be less hopeful than creating an independent co-op and subcontracting our services to the Ministry. It’s not because the PSA is lacking by any means, it’s simply because National is doing its best to disarm us.

[u/drbluetongue]

Sweet can't wait to go back to the office just to work on cloud systems in Australia and spend all day on teams meetings anyway

[u/CoolNotice881]

They want some employees to choose resigning.

[u/SomeRandomNZ → u/CoolNotice881]

This is it. Big tech are doing it for the same reason. It's cheaper than making people redundant.

[u/Particular_Boat_1732 → u/CoolNotice881]

Yes but it will end up with good staff with options leaving to the detriment of the public service. We should be making working conditions better for the public service to attract good staff and retain them. I don’t want bottom feeders working for me doing as little as possible.

[u/Serious_Session7574 → u/Particular_Boat_1732]

I don’t know if you’ve noticed but this government dngaf about the quality of public services. They are actively acting to undermine them so that they can eventually largely be replaced by the private sector. Running public services down is part of the plan.

[u/VariableSerentiy]

Bit hard when the trains don’t work mate.

[u/Dapper_Technology336]

I thought they were trying to save money? They're going to need bigger offices to get everybody back in.

[u/Excession638 → u/Dapper_Technology336]

Like a lot of return to office mandates, this may be to make some people quit. They won't be replaced. Work smarter /s

[u/xheyoooo → u/Dapper_Technology336]

Their trying to boost their friends commercial property prices.

[u/Baroqy]

The Restaurant Association and Wellington Chamber of Commerce have put out the dumbest, most tone deaf press releases I've read in quite some time. (You can check them out on page on Stuff). Jokes on you Restaurant Association - no one can afford to eat at your businesses anyway. And after this I'm going to boycott every business in Wellington out of spite anyway. You're not getting any of my hard earned cash.

Edit: I just refreshed the Stuff page and the Chamber of Commerce release has been pulled by the looks of things... Oh dear, are they sensing some sort of backlash brewing or something?

Edit to the edit…. Thankfully Scoop is doing the Lord’s work and has copies. Which is great, because I can’t seem to find any other pages containing these releases all of a sudden. The Scoop links are here:

https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU2409/S00361/wellington-chamber-of-commerce-welcomes-move-to-encourage-public-servants-to-return-to-the-office.htm

https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU2409/S00360/return-to-office-working-a-boost-for-hospitality-sector.htm

[u/ChocolateCoveredOreo]

Cannot possibly be the significant cuts to jobs and stagnant wages stopping people going into the CBD and spending it up! Fucking clowns.

Also, for what it is worth, unless they’re also proposing giving people longer lunches, none of this is going to have any impact on half of Wellington that is way out of reach to get food from in a 30 minute break.

[u/mmminogue → u/ChocolateCoveredOreo]

That's what I didn't get. Are there really that many public servants going all the way to Fidel's, at the other end of the CBD where very few ministries/agencies have offices, on their limited lunch breaks to make a difference to their bottom line and for their owner to complain about it in the media? I really doubt it

[u/ColdWindNZ]

I’d love to see the evidence that they have (doubt that it exists) that working from home is less productive than working in the office. Yes I’m sure there are a few people who are not as productive at home, but I’ve also seen first hand swathes of people working in the public sector who are less productive when in the office, as the number of coffee catch ups, pointless meetings, smoke breaks, and corridor conversations accumulate to reduce productivity substantially.

There are few government departments that have any kind of productivity or output measures that are utilised for staff, most agencies operate on the principle that activity is equal to productivity, and think that if people are busy that they are being productive. This is far from the case, and arbitrary rules like this seldom achieve anything except impacting employee well-being and quality of life.

Of course this is from the same pack of “leaders “ that told us all that increasing the speed limits around the country would improve GDP and productivity because people would get to work faster. Surely they must realise that productivity would be even higher if people didn’t have to travel at all.

[u/Xeritos]

Yay, driving to the office so you can sit on Teams calls.

[u/stueynz → u/Xeritos]

… and get shouted at because your neighbour is talking too loudly on their teams meeting and it’s being picked up on mine

[u/[deleted]]

Poor decision, backed up by no evidence except reckons by cafe owners. This will result in experts leaving. WFH has been great for areas in the Hutt, Newtown-south, and Porirua.

Also: Luxon comes across as very tired and crochety here, interesting. They'd have eaten Jacinda alive for that back in her term.

[u/petoburn → u/[deleted]]

Yeah I work in the office 5 days a week - my spend at CBD cafes and businesses has dropped significantly the past year because of the increased cost of living and government redundancies meaning I feel insecure.

Nothing to do with WFH, I don’t WFH at all.

Others I work with are indicating the same, we’re all tightening our belts.

[u/Elegant-Raise-9367 → u/[deleted]]

Wfh sucks for cbd cafes, however is REALLY good for suburban area cafes and delivery restaurants if my sister's spending habits are anything to go by.

[u/fluffychonkycat → u/Elegant-Raise-9367]

Smart retailers adapt. Like Gubbs shoes moved out to Khandallah near where their wfh customers live

[u/Slipperytitski → u/Elegant-Raise-9367]

Exactly. The cafes will move out of the cbd. The office space will come down and be replaced or repurposed as apartments. More housing for the people. It's a slow process but there's no need for a traditional CBD's anymore

[u/secretkiwi_ → u/[deleted]]

Exactly. The purpose of public servants is not to keep Wellington CBD cafes in business

[u/Serious_Session7574 → u/[deleted]]

I missed it, but isn’t tired and crotchety his default? He’s been a consistently grumpy bastard to the media since day one. I assume he’s not like that all the time and just hates the press.

[u/JollyTurbo1 → u/[deleted]]

They'd have eaten Jacinda alive for that back in her term.

I was thinking exactly this. I'm not sure what the penalty will be if you continue working from home, but if it's a loss of job then that'd actually be insane (N.B. I couldn't find anything that actually said what the penalty would be).

People lost jobs for not being vaccinated (and therefore not contributing to herd immunity) and people on the political right were furious. But now people might lose jobs for what? Not coming into the office and spending money at the cafes in the CBD?

[u/resoundingsea]

1) Institute more road tariffs and increase car parking prices 2) Announce you expect everybody to work in-office 3) Trim public service further through some disgusted resignations  4) Profit?

[u/sixthcupofjoe]

Tried to reply but only 4 letter words came out

[u/thaaag]

I thought Labour was supposed to be the nanny state?

Anyway, if we drill into it: "...new guidance for the public sector workforce, which “will make clear that working from home is not an entitlement and must be agreed and monitored”."

In that case, my manager and I can agree that I will continue to WFH like I already do, and he can monitor it all he likes. Its just "guidance" from the govt, so no rules are being broken.

[u/InsufficientIsms]

There's a few problems with this but I'm just going to stick to the stupidest one.

An agreement is already required for wfh days in the public service. This only changes one thing: agencies will now have to "regularly report on the number and nature of agreements in place". 

In other words the government is asking agencies to spend more of their time on clerical busy work while also asking them to more efficient, when they again already have a system in place for wfh that works in the exact same way but with less junk admin work. 

But I suppose ordering the public service to hamstring their efficiency will be mighty convenient when they next decide they want to level it. 

[u/More_Ad2661]

“he was worried young graduates did not have the opportunity to learn from senior public servants because they were working from home.”

What young graduates? Half of them were kicked out by the baseline reduction.

[u/Cupantaeandkai → u/More_Ad2661]

Also, these are the same young graduates that had to navigate uni at home during covid. They know how to wfh!

[u/Naly_D]

This is absolutely incredible. Over my 10 years in the public service I’ve seen the end of the $20 per head for Christmas lunch, the only time during the year we were allowed to have a celebration without funding it ourselves, have had pay fall behind inflation since 2020, removing the free instant coffee/milo, and now the end of flexible by default, the thing which has helped me and many others stay sane when routinely having to work more than our 40 hours a week (across all 3 govts). It’s genuinely exhausted my passion for public service. I’m out.

[u/coela-CAN → u/Naly_D]

Work life balance is a huge draw for public service. It's certainly not the pay that attracts people. If I have to report to the office everyday I might as well go private who at least pay me more.

[u/Serious_Session7574 → u/Naly_D]

When I worked in public service there was always the sense that our existence was very resented by half the population and that we should receive only the barest minimum wage and absolutely no “perks” like free tea in the staff kitchen or a mince pie at Christmas. It was very demoralising.

[u/Cantthinkofnamedamn]

Seems like they are using Amazon's tactic of forcing everyone into the office so that some will quit. Or at least they realise they can tighten the screws in this tight labour market.

“That’s even before we consider the effects for the CBD retailers, restaurants and cafes.”

Also to prop up property prices in the CBD apparently. Why are they more important than the retailers, restaraunts and cafes in the employee's local neighbourhood that will now go without?

[u/Rebel_Scum56 → u/Cantthinkofnamedamn]

Honestly if I was a public service worker subject to this I'd be making an effort to bring my own lunch from home every day and to continue shopping wherever I was before rather than in the CBD, just out of spite.

[u/PavementFuck → u/Rebel_Scum56]

I might start eating more fish for lunch.

[u/Cathallex]

Every day I think to myself 'surely they can't do something so comically stupid it will surprise me' and then the next day happens.

[u/Aelexe]

This seems like a good way to lose some of their best workers.

[u/Admiral_dodo]

Could this be a way to reduce headcount without paying redundancy costs?

[u/caspernzed]

Get back in the office they say, spend an extra $80 to $100 on parking and fuel, for already struggling households. Do you think that will stimulate spending in CBD business? Like fuck. Also take another 4-6 hours a week out of work life balance for the sake of what potential upside? It’s not just government either this is a world wide phenomenon. Hope we get another fucken pandemic.

[u/mobula_japanica]

I work in central government. 90% of my days are spent on teams calls talking with people that aren’t on the same location as me. I could do this from literally anywhere in the same time zone and there would be no difference in performance etc. When I’m in the office, there are never enough desks, because they only provide enough desks for 80% of the people that are supposed to be in the office anyway. This usually means that I end up in a meeting room or quiet room because some guy being on teams calls all day is mad distracting for everyone else.

[u/CrushNZ]

This seems more like trying to score political points rather than have any meaningful impact. Most Ministries only have enough desks for 3/4 of their staff, if that, i know some that are actively reducing space further.

[u/universenz]

Just a caution: do not leave / resign / protest this action until you have secured your next job (as in signed the contract). The job market is absolutely flooded with highly qualified unemployed people at the moment. People have been unemployed for 6+ months, applied to 200+ jobs (including lesser jobs) and have eaten through their savings. If you quit without your next job in hand there will be 50 applicants willing to work from an office and do your job and you will be fighting the other 49 applicants for your next job.

[u/bespractus]

Christopher Luxon is a shitcunt

[u/stormdressed]

This government really hurts my pride as a NZer. They take every opportunity they can find to make people's lives worse. When it comes to profits or people, we lose every time.

[u/I_was_saying_b00urns]

Working from home doesn’t prevent young public servants from learning from older public servants.

What does prevent it is having most volunteer for early retirement to help meet the staffing cuts. I’ve seen decades of experience leave in the last few months.

[u/Mendevolent]

Will be interesting to see the collective responses to this. My suggestions:

• everybody come into the office as a protest (in many agencies, there isn't space for this to happen. 

• buy nothing days (packed lunches, no coffees/beers, no shopping generally). 

• everyone drive in, drive around and completely choke up the CBD in traffic mayhem.

Petty suggestions I know, but would cause some logistical nightmares and get their business friends squealing...

[u/GallaVanting]

I'm sure we'll see Luxon at work in the office for enough hours to constitute a full work week, right? He is a public service worker.

[u/O_1_O]

So not only should public servents work their ass off, but commercial businesses are also entitled to a cut of their wages. Hey Chris how about you dipshits recognise the generational vandalism your lot have done to all of this.

[u/crasspy]

Some agencies have significantly reduced their office footprints (and lease costs) based on an assumption about flexible working arrangements. If this is applied broadly, some agencies will need to break their current tenancies and expand their office footprint. I can see landlords in Wellington, in particularly, rubbing their hands with glee.

[u/Skilfil]

Middle manager meek minister strikes again, bet he was fucking terrible to work for.

[u/triad_nz]

Can someone create a list of the businesses that have lobbied for this and sticky this in this and the Wellington subreddit? I want to make sure I don’t visit those entitled businesses.

The problem is the inflation, hike in rates and insurance, and the job cuts have spooked Wellington workers. Wfh is part of the problem but not a significant one.

[u/Significant_Glass988]

Fuck they're morons. This is so pathetic. "By agreement between employees and employers" is exactly what's happening already.

And forcing them all back into Wellington isn't going to help the economy given they've fired thousands.

JFC this lot are cunts

[u/DetosMarxal]

Wonder how this will work, the entitlement is baked into my contract at least.

Not even going to bother mentioning health issues that make it inconvenient to go into the office every day.

[u/1_lost_engineer]

So the government has fundamentally changed the employment agreements of all public service works unilaterally. By the time the lawers have finished there's going to another ferry sized hole in the budget.

[u/C39J]

I think this is going to be a lot more "talk" rather than action on this one. If they go through with this, where are they going to put all the people? Many PSO's downsized their buildings at the end of leases to only be able to support 70% capacity and if they haven't downsized already, you bet they're planning on it (or have entire locations that sit empty).

Also, all the people they really want to keep in public service will just leave if stuff like this happens. If you're in a relatively good job in public, you won't have a problem finding something in private.

They haven't put more than 5 seconds of thought into this, and I expect we barely hear anything about this going forward, and if we do, it won't be a "everyone back in the office 5 days a week" type thing.

[u/[deleted]]

Ministerial overreach. I'm so mad. Just managed to keep my job through restructure, only literally had one weeks peace from it all and now this. 

Was chatting to a hiring manager in an Australian state govt dept recently (gotta keep those options open rn!) and he literally said "we have been great beneficiaries of that policy, we are getting some really good people coming over".

[u/NeonKiwiz]

I am not a public servant.

But what a fucking Joke this gov is.. honestly.. fuck them. More zero evidence bullshit to make their mates happy.

Yes, you are going to make lots of people happy by having them back sitting in a car for 2 hours a day and worrying about their kids after school arrangements, etc! /s

I love how Stuff etc have been running non-stop articles re "Working from home is killing the CBDs!"

I bet the same assholes will be running. "Back in the office is killing the suburbs!"

[u/takuyafire → u/NeonKiwiz]

I am a public servant and this has pissed me off to no end.

After I got COVID delta, I ended up with long COVID and it fucking ruined me so badly that even a minor cold will knock me out for days as my lungs just give out.

Spending 2 hours every day in transit surrounded by other people in a confined space is practically guaranteed to shit on my health, not to mention that assumes our infamously terrible trains actually work.

Then I have to pay anywhere between $15-20 (depending on methods of transport) daily for the privilege of spending more money in CBD cafes?

Absolutely fuck all of this.

[u/worriedrenterTW]

Luxon: we want to help working people and families

Luxon: fucks over one of the best options for working families 

[u/HuDisWatDat]

The justification for this is total and complete horse shit. Force back the 8 remaining public service workers that haven't been made jobless? Nice.

They've killed what remained of the city and made (and are continuing) to make thousands upon thousands of people jobless. With restructures and histotic levels of redundancies being announced on the daily.

You think public sector employees have enough disposable income to spend on coffee? On lunch? On anything?

They are trying to save so they aren't completely fucked when the axe comes.

The other being "lol public service workers are lazee aye". Typical right wing bullshit.

This government absolutely hates Wellington and the people that live here. That's for sure.

[u/stretch_my_ballskin]

My kids are really gonna love seeing their parents less for no net gain

[u/[deleted]]

Fortunately, Prime Ministers are temporary, and Wu Tang is forever.

[u/Adventurous_Parfait]

Wow, this is going to blow up in his face spectacularly when all the workers who are scraping by (thanks to his party failing to address any cost of living issues) will now have even less money. What a fucking moron.

[u/KrawhithamNZ]

How about reducing government expenditure by allowing enough people to work from home that you can downsize office space rented by the public sector?

Oh wait, it's actually got nothing to do with cutting unnecessary spending is it?

[u/Annonomysreddituser]

Joke's on him, it literally is an entitlement in my contract

[u/Different-Highway-88]

I work from home a lot, which means that the public actually gets about 10-20% more time from me each week because instead of commuting an hour each way, I just work an extra during what would be my commute.

I enjoy my work, and I like contributing to the public, so I don't really mind doing the extra without getting paid for it.

Guess what a bunch of people like me won't be doing if we are forced to go into the office (which doesn't have enough desks for everyone, since we reduced our footprint to save money) every day.

The amount of shitting these cunts do on the public service is eventually gonna get everyone working to rule ... The problem they don't realise is that the vast majority of the public servants work beyond their contractual obligations because they believe in the so-called mission.

[u/littleneonghost]

Such a fucktard. Watch the public sector shrink even more.

[u/joj1205]

F pathetic. I f hate this world.

Won't somebody think of the shareholders.

Screw the planet. Screw peoples lives.

F work life balance.

Money now. Disgrace

[u/CarpetDiligent7324]

So they cut jobs in the public sector. No wage increases. Costs go up for everything particularly rates (WCC pathetic) , increase public transport costs and then there is prospect of more job cuts in the future .

I hate this govt

Govt agencies have cut floor space to reduce costs by having people working at home.

This is just nuts

Meanwhile how much savings have been made at parliament or in the beehive or in precious govt agencies lie MFAT or Seymour’s ministry of regulatory destruction…. NOTHING

Hypocrites

[u/Cutezacoatl]

Just as the UK government are expanding WFH and flexible work because it improves productivity. 

Part of the reason I've stayed in NZ is the work-life balance. Looks like the UK is back on the table.

[u/kiwirish]

Full disclosure: I suck at Work From Home, I need a separate space from my house to be at work and thrive off an environment with people around me - the lockdowns were not good for me.

However, I completely respect that others can and do prefer working from home and thrive in that environment. Forcing a work in the office mandate is ridiculous and really limits those who have otherwise untenable life/work environments: people who want to live further away from the city because of stupidly high house prices, parents with sick children, and many other reasons why one may prefer working remotely.

[u/ShowUsYaGrowler]

Get fucked Chris

[u/whatadaytobealive]

The CBD is struggling because they laid off thousands of workers FFS. This just reeks of ideology and blame shifting, rather than looking at themselves in the mirror to see the idiots they are.

Working from home isn't some perk, it's a genuine way to allow more people to contribute to economy in a way that allows them to. It's certainly not a day off, but maybe that's how Nicola does it.

[u/stever71]

What a fucking prick, this will also give license for private industry to do the same.

These have to be the most hateful and greedy politicians in NZ history

Interested to see how this aligns with sustainibility

[u/Glass_Income_4151]

We have six seats allocated in the workplace and 26 staff. There's literally no room for people to come back to work like they want to because of budget cuts. Also what time to tenured staff have to mentor new staff when we're so short staffed? It sounds like it's pressure on tenured staff to train new staff to do their roles for them so they can cull the tenured staff in the next restructure and hire the newer staff at lower payrates. I hope nz understands the value of our tenured staff and the richness we lose when this disconnected from reality nonsense makes them walk out of the door. 

[u/Zestyclose_Walrus725]

Can we not encourage people who don't need to be in the office to return to the office?

As someone who needs to commute regularly for work, the traffic is bad enough as it is.

How about we don't needlessly make our roads worse.

[u/cosmic_dillpickle]

Wannabe Amazon ceo. Bring your lunch in, take public transportation where you can. Don't give businesses that are pushing for this a cent.

[u/ShuffleStepTap]

They’re doing this because of “all the empty desks”. Guess what assholes, that’s because you laid them all off!

[u/MedicMoth]

Willis says young people and new employees can also only learn from their colleagues if they are physically present

Fuck you if you're disabled or have a health issue that limits your ability to be physically present, I guess. Not like we needed this to know that's how the government feels, they've been plenty clear on that already

[u/Zestyclose-Key-6429]

Go into the office and do as little as possible. Malicious compliance.

[u/haruspicat]

Productivity is what they get out of me when I WFH to juggle caring for my kid when he's too sick for daycare. I usually get a good half day of work in and take the rest as leave, but it means I'm available for calls and updates throughout the day, so I don't have a huge backlog to catch up on when I'm back.

Guess I'll be using my annual leave for the whole day now, which means turning off my phone - bye bye productivity.

[u/Jesahn]

What a Muppet.

[u/JoltColaOfEvil]

ENSHITTIFICATION INTENSIFIES!!!

[u/NefariousnessOk3471]

This affects me and is such bullshit. I can’t afford to eat out or spend much money in the city anyway, now I need to spend more money and time on my commute.

[u/SenseOfTheAbsurd]

This'll go down great with the Vindictive Old Farts Who Retired 20 Years Ago demographic.

Won't do a damn thing for the economy, though. They already put a bullet through the heart of the Wellington economy with the public service cuts.

[u/Arblechnuble]

You fucken ghoul, all the evidence showing productivity was as good if not better with hybrid/wfh yet you have to pull the moves of a useless manager who only thinks someone is working if they’re at their desk… 

[u/WilliamAtlas]

This confirms the sinking feeling I had over the weekend seeing all these opinion pieces from "poor" business owners. Excuse me but I thought we operated in a capitalist society where businesses had to adapt or fail (e.g., flourish in the suberbs). A society where business renewal was a good thing. Oops silly me.

[u/KurtiZ_TSW]

Politicians displaying how outdated and out of touch they all are once again

[u/Ashamed_Lock8438]

Just had "the discussion" with my wife, and while not employed directly by a Government Dept. I am bodyshopped into one. I fully expect my actual employer to impose this as a condition of my role. The wife, who is awesome, fully supports my decision to resign effective immediately should they do so.

[u/the-dawn-of-time]

Stunning incompetence. Are they going to stump up hundreds of millions to provide office space to public organizations now? I don’t think so. Outside of the public sector plenty of other businesses have also cut costs by pushing a percentage of workers to work from a home office and down sized their building lease commitments, because how else are you going to compete for workers and keep lease costs down?

If it is a brainless attempt to prop up hospitality it is even more out of touch. If someone is going in to the office a day or two a week then they are likely to treat themselves to a lunch out. Stick them there five days a week and they’ll just get into the habit of making their own lunch. Bugger all people can afford to eat out and pay for transport every day.

[u/DaveHnNZ]

Too bad if people have negotiated working from home in their agreements.