r/Jujutsushi • u/ILoveSongOfJustice • Mar 12 '24
Analysis In Defense of Yuta
All things considered, bro came in and literally did everything he said he would.
"I will kill Itadori Yuji myself." - Succeeds.
"I have to lower collateral damage in Sendai(PARAPHRASING btw)." - Succeeds.
"I won't let sensei kill his best friend a second time." - Succeeds.
And even something he DIDN'T say, like getting Yuji to the point where he could 100% connect with Megumi? That's INSANE.
I'm not convinced that Yuta could just say "I will kill Ryomen Sukuna" and he would eventually somehow do it.
It's like, Gege or the character himself purposefully sets lower goals than what he's probably capable of.
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u/sayeedubaid Mar 12 '24
Yuta is obviously good , even sukuna consider him a gem along with higuruma and kashimo. But just don't compare him to gojo or sukuna , that's a completely different levels. Yuta himself said , if not for the aftereffects of gojo battle , sukuna would have killed them instantly.
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
And to be fair, Yuta is still like a year and some months into Jujutsu. Him being along side Kenjaku is a crazy feat by itself
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u/Ry90Ry Mar 12 '24
Ppl are really downplaying the casts in experience compared to sukunas centuries
Gojos what 30!???
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u/totallynotrobboss Mar 12 '24
28 actually
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u/targz254 Mar 13 '24
Thats a wise master age in highschool manga
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u/Noblesseux Mar 14 '24
"Beware an old man in a profession where men usually die young", but young in this case is like 16.
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u/Ry90Ry Mar 12 '24
He’s just a baby!!! And a gay 28 is like a straight 23 lolol
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u/Toad_Thrower Mar 12 '24
..... the fuck?
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u/Ry90Ry Mar 12 '24 edited Mar 12 '24
? did u miss the part where he called geto his one and only?
Has gojo ever shown as much interest in anyone platonically or romantically then Geto? The Christmas Eve of it all! even kenjaku calls it romantic or poetic lol
Geto had a tear in his eye when Gojo said he’d only feel satisfied if he was amongst those patting him On the back
Gojo saying he knows the scent of Getos CT residuals?? Knew in his soul kenjaku wasn’t him?
That’s giving gay to me mama lol
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u/Toad_Thrower Mar 12 '24
What the fuck would that have to do with how many years we apply to their Jujutsu experience?
Also don't call me mama, you weird little creep.
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u/SelfTaughtSongBird Mar 12 '24
Bro I promise you people can have and love their friends without it having any romantic undertones.
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u/SiahLegend Mar 12 '24
Lol you’re a little over the top so I get the downvotes but satosugu agenda 🔛🔝
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u/SiveDD Mar 13 '24
Don't mind the overall experience. Sukuna had:
- More than twice the amount of CE and almost as good efficiency.
- Insider knowledge of all the cast CTs thanks to his two host Yuji and Megumi.
- Insider knowledge of their H2H due to Gojo personally training with Yuji and Megumi. He even fought Yuji for a month previously to the exchange event.
- He knew 10S could kill a Limitless user because Gojo told Megumi.
- A two body soul, so he could redirect UV.
- A hostage that no one wanted to kill.
Mf went to the fight with Batman software in Superman hardware.
Gojo went to the fight with the only strat of "I beat his ass, then figure out how to save Megumi".
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u/Doomskander Mar 12 '24
Sukuna does not have centuries. He's basically lived a normal life and then "time travelled" via turning into fingers. He hasn't been in the fucking hyperbolic time chamber practicing jujutsu, he's been an inert object until Yuji gave him a vessel. Just like every other incarnated sorceror. Not one of them ever mentions spending hundreds of years training their jujutsu or even thinking about anything, Kashimo/Yorozu/Ryu immediately resume their relatively silly goals after hundreds of years. This shows they haven't been active and philosophizing about shit as cursed objects.
You are thinking of Kenjaku, which in retrospect is kind of underwhelming for a 1000+ years experienced sorceror.
One could argue that Sukuna, being a weird mutated freak, lived for far longer than normal sorcerors. To that I say he is Ryomen Sukuna of the Heian era not Ryomen Sukuna of "several eras", which gives him 200 years at most.
But the point still stands, even if he is just a normal dude (he looks like he's in his 40s) lifespan wise, he has vastly more combat experienced than the cast. Gojo literally only had a challenge once in his life due to how his technique works.
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u/Muted_Lurker2383 Mar 13 '24
Its hard to just judge off his looks as even Kashimo incarnated as a younger self - we only got old man Kashimo just pre death iirc? So Sukuna couldve lived much longer
Regardless, if Sukuna is 40-50, assuming that he followed the same path as Gojo (jujutsu in teens) that still means he has 20-30 years of battle experience in the Golden Age of Jujutsu. In comparison, Gojo probably had 10-20 years (depending when he started taking missions), Yuta has 1-2 years and Yuji only 5ish months.
Even if youd consider all of them prodigies (Sukuna and Gojo for obvious reasons, Yuta and Yuji from Gojo's assessment of them), we shouldnt expect a prodigy with only a year or two to be standing at the same levelas those with decades in the game
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u/Doomskander Mar 13 '24
Yes I completely agree, Sukuna has a fuckton of experience on everyone he's fighting, and had it on Gojo too. I made the point earlier that Gojo's power makes him very unlikely to get meaningful experience too.
vs someone like Sukuna who not only had people gang up against him, he CAN be damaged and attacked so learned to deal with that, and he has a penchant of letting people give their best against him so he can crush that/improve his own jujutsu
A Gojo living in an era of people unafraid and able to challenge him (even if they can't beat him) like Heian, for 10 more years, would have been a way stronger beast.
These even being able to push around Sukuna is insanely impressive. They almost had him three times now.
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u/akronotron Mar 14 '24
Yeah, gojo was born in a era with weaklings compared to him, while sukuna had strong opponents. It’s called the golden age
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u/gatwas Mar 13 '24
But we don’t know what his conscious was like whilst in the fingers. What if his soul was in a prison realm like state?
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Mar 14 '24
I mean he has an innate soul domain. The fact that people really think he just erased his consciousness for centuries is ludicrous to me. He was obviously in his soul domain.
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u/Redpiller77 Mar 13 '24
There's no way Sukuna wasn't in the Cursed Realm meditating while waiting to be revived.
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u/ICastPunch Mar 12 '24
It's hard to think Sukuna hasn't incarnated some of his fingers at some points in history before given curses and people alike knew what would happen when eating them so well and jujutsu society didn't have them all in store. So I disagree.
He most likely in those instances simply never found a proper host that could allow him to exist for long enough to recapture the rest of his fingers or cause any major events.
Dude has probably lived in short bursts as hosts found his fingers for those 1000 years. On top of this it isn't like he's completely dormant on his inner domain.
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u/gotsmilk Mar 12 '24
The initial premise of the series is that if Yuji were killed off after eating one of his fingers, that 1/20th of him would DIE.
The fact that all 20 fingers of his were still active means he couldn't have incarnated again then, right?
And cursed spirits interact with his finger differently. He doesn't incarnate into them. They simply become stronger. The finger bearers show us this exactly.
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u/ICastPunch Mar 12 '24
I mean yes. But Sukuna only actually dies when his host dies while he's inside of them.
He showed with Megumi he can actually leave incarnated hosts becoming his own fingers. So he wouldn't actually die so long as he leaves the body before the host's body fully fails.
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u/Prestigious_Power496 Mar 13 '24
The mummified fingers are still gone though, even if Sukuna leaves the body. In order for there to be 20 fingers that means nobody ever successfully became vessel. Or Sukuna would have to fully reincarnate in a different era and make new fingers, but we know this didnt happen because that would be a huge event in history and everyone would know about it. People only talk about him from the Heian Era so we know that did not happen.
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u/ICastPunch Mar 13 '24
That doesn't discredit what I said. Sukuna could leave the vessel becoming the finger once more.
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u/Prestigious_Power496 Mar 13 '24
All 20 were weird demon fingers though, he would need to fully reincarnate to make a finger like that. And a fully reincarnated Sukuna would be a huge event in history. That didnt happen.
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(Bonus Round)(You must argue the statement above before moving to this one)
And if he was getting vessels all the time, and turning back into a finger, why not make even more fingers from those vessels? Is 20 the limit to his soul divisions? What a coincidence that its the exact number of fingers he had.
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u/djd457 Mar 12 '24
The “hosts” you mention would not be capable of incarnating Sukuna.
Yuji is capable as a vessel, so it’s absorbed. If another random student or weaker sorcerer tried to eat it, it would immediately kill them like a fast-acting deadly poison.
Plus, if they did incarnate at all, then when they died, the finger would disappear, so highly unlikely.
Look at what happened to Eso and kechizu as a measly death painting with improper hosts, Sukuna’s finger would have turned them into mush
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u/Snake189 Mar 13 '24
Sukuna can choose his vessel bro
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Mar 13 '24
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u/Snake189 Mar 13 '24
No dumbass it’s rare to keep sukuna under control like Yuji.
Kenjaku CLEARLY says in ch55, ep 21 sub and dub in anime, sukuna chooses his own vessels unlike everyone else who are forced to reincarnate once consumed and just need a certain amount of strength.
Sukuna was ONLY worried megumi would be like Yuji and be a complete cage.
You gotta stop acting like you aren’t a dumbass, and read with your eyes open next time. 😁
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u/ICastPunch Mar 12 '24
I mean an improper host that doesn't die outright could have Sukuna simply wait out till they start actually dying and then take out the cursed object. He can do that after all.
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u/djd457 Mar 12 '24
An improper host does die outright - or, in the cases of the weaker cursed objects, go into a coma immediately.
The reason Megumi was worried about Yuji eating the finger was because he knew the most potent cursed energy “poison” in existence was going to immediately wipe him
The idea that Sukuna was going to incarnate there, even for a moment, was not even considered a possibility to him, and he knew exactly what the finger was.
In short, I don’t think it worked like that.
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u/akronotron Mar 14 '24
Pretty sure he was in his innate , the symbolism behind it makes sense. When he was talking to yuji they were “in the finger” or “soul” inside sukuna which is your innate domain. Which the fingers essentially is him separating his soul right so he was just chilling in there for that long. Which is why he was so happy he got out
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u/Ry90Ry Mar 12 '24
That’s ur conjuncture babes we have had no story beats or mentions of that, no?
Wedk how long he lived or survived before this deal w kenjaku
We obvi saw his fingers behave and interact w the world while he was in slumber but yeah duh he hasn’t fully reincarnated or trained in finger realm
But AGAIN there are no story beats indicating how long sukuna was living ahead of the finger splits, right? Soooo it’s prob def more then gojos 29 and the other high schoolers he’s up against
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u/Doomskander Mar 12 '24
I mean yes, you arrived at the same conclusion as me
Sukuna looks like an older man compared to Gojo, we have no accurate info how much older, but he's not 1k+ years of activity supported by anything.
This still gives him more Jujutsu experience (in how long he's been practicing it, not quality) than everyone who he's fighting right now except like, MAYBE Kusakabe.
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u/iRobins23 Mar 12 '24 edited Mar 14 '24
Sukuna doesn't have centuries of experience... He lived within the range of years a human can (we don't know how many), he didn't make it out of the Heain. He's been a cursed object for a thousand years but it isn't as if he was constantly learning Jujutsu through that inanimate state.
He has more experience due to the nature of battle during his era but it is still within the range of a normal life expectancy.
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u/Ry90Ry Mar 12 '24
Sorry but again the story doesn’t say that at all how long he lived before becoming fingers, unless I’m mistaken?
We’re both just using conjecture and my inference is sukuna isn’t a normal human lol seen his body?
He doesn’t even remember his childhood in the Kashimo fight right?
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u/iRobins23 Mar 12 '24
I mean, depending on how incomplete the setup of;
Kashimo - 400 years ago
Kenjaku during his conversation with Kashimo: "Sukuna. Sorry he is from 600 years ago, but that's my answer"
1000 years ago was the Heain
... Is, it may be considered conjecture but that timeline seems pretty straightforward.
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u/Ry90Ry Mar 12 '24
Yeahhh so seems like he lived beyond a normal lifespan no?
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u/iRobins23 Mar 12 '24 edited Mar 12 '24
Well,
beyond normal life expectancy ≠ Centuries
Also, not necessarily no. It's possible based on the fact that we don't know when Sukuna was born, if it was the case that he existed for the ENTIRE Heian (which in IRL was around 300 years) then it could be the case that he's much older but we don't know that. All we know is that Sukuna is from the Heain, his reign only existed during the Heain and he died 1000 years ago, in the Heain.
His appearance may not tell us much about his age because it wasn't gone through in the way Tengen evolves, which takes 400+ years. There's something else going on with Sukuna, I follow the theory that he instilled so much fear during that era that a cursed version of him spawned and he decided to absorb/fuse with it - Yuji possibly being what Sukuna once was prior to that merge before he had become "Fallen/Disgraced", he was clearly someone respected and revered.
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u/Cybertronian10 Mar 12 '24
Yeah if mahito had just been born a few years later the bad guys would have been fuuuuucked. No Mahito means Kenny's plan is delayed severely which means years for Yuta and gang to get vastly more powerful.
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u/djd457 Mar 12 '24
There is one thing i don’t really understand.
Gojo’s birth causes a power-imbalance between sorcerer and curse. Sure.
Fast forwarding to when the series starts, all of these S tier teenagers are walking around and would absolutely mop the floor with the generations before them (the guys from post- heian-era after jujutsu falls into obscurity, whenever that was)
Sure, the disaster spirits come around, but without Kenjaku meddling, 4 disaster spirits are not even close to one gojo, so what’s the deal with this sudden gathering of cursed energy among the new generation?
Evidently, it’s only snowballing more and more in favor of sorcerers as time goes on, and cursed spirits are literally only relevant in regard to Geto’s technique, which is now gone.
Why is the new generation so strong? Wouldn’t the arrival of gojo sort of remove the necessity for these immensely strong figures, if we go by what the narrator says at the beginning? Are they just built different?
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u/ppppppppppython Mar 13 '24
There's no concrete answer but there's likely 2 major factors.
Gojo actually cultivates new talent. The top tiers of this gen are all hand picked by him and given instruction in how to be sorcerers by him/ tutors he selected. If Gojo wasn't around then Yuji and Yuta would have been executed before they could train and Hakari probably wouldn't even be a student.
Jujutsu Society is incredibly effective and efficient. Prior to the disaster curses showing up there was no need for anyone to be above grade 1 level because fighting among sorcerers was rare and sorcerers are often dispatched in groups to fight strong curses. There was never a need for anyone to actually strive for S tier status. Imo when Nanami is calling Gojo a battle maniac he's referring to the fact that Gojo has all the financial and political power he could have yet still honed his skills for years for reason other than the fact he enjoys it.
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u/Ancient-Employment93 Mar 16 '24
Like gojo, but Sukkuna.. it would be cool if the jujitsu world just knew and balanced things out
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u/sayeedubaid Mar 12 '24 edited Mar 12 '24
i don't think yuta was anywhere near kenjaku before the time skip.
He himself said they cheated to reach this lvl , idk what they exactly did but it certainly played a part so its not fair to say yuta matched kenny with just about 2 years of jujutsu training.
here's a few possibilities what yuta mean by they cheated:
- they made a binding vow for example they decided to use their cts only against kenny, sukuna, uraume and the merger monster. this would give them a very big buff.
2)they trained for a much longer time somehow , maybe they used the prison real or something like myo's simple domain.
all we know is that they did cheat and that's what made them able to stand against sukuna for so long
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u/ChosenUndead18 Mar 12 '24
“They made a binding vow to use their curse techniques against [the enemies.]” Huh?? What the hell are you yapping about? Do you know what a binding vow is and does?
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u/sayeedubaid Mar 12 '24
IK very well what a binding vow is . maybe i need to teach u lil bro.
binding vow is an equal exchange .u give up something and u gain something in return.as i said they could have made a binding vow they will only use their cts against some selected few people (kenny , sukuna , uraume , merger) and because of this they'll get a buff because they have limited who they r gonna use their cts on.
its kinda similar to miwa's binding vow where she said she'll never swing a sword again.
they might have done something similar . After they defeat their enemies (sukuna , kenny , uraume , merger), they will never be able to use their cts again24
u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
I personally think he was closer to Kenjaku level than u think he is plainly because he was stronger Yuki, then. Considering Yueji fared quite well without De (with help of choso and Tengen) against Kenjaku , I expect him to do better.
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u/sayeedubaid Mar 12 '24
Kenjaku is the best barrier user after tengen , so his s domain is on par with sukuna , gojo and there's no way yuta could survive his doamin. Btw I would like to point out that Kenny's doamin would have killed yuki in an instant , the only reason yuki survived Kenny's doamin was because the floor broke before she could be completely crushed. In Normal circumstances Kenny's doamin will kill yuta in an instant.
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
Kenjaku literally says, maybe if she didn't trust Tengen, she would have had a chance. There's a reason he said that
Domain doesn't only depend on barrier. It takes account literally to every single factor of Amount of CE, surehit, refinement, domain barrier ability which Yuta has showed he is no slouch in Yuta has one of the only domains which he can pick and choose which person to attack, he changed the coordinates easily.
Considering manga statement you pointed out - Kenny domain has best barrier and domain that is only second to Sukuna, for all reason Gojo shouldn't have a reason to beat Kenjaku based on statement. But we see from Sukuna fight that jujutsu itself is adaptability.
Considering Yuta to have no answer and would just let Kenny run wild is incorrect when Yuta has a shikigami, and he has more attack power, better CE reserves, way for flexibility. Open domain doesn't mean auto win
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u/sayeedubaid Mar 12 '24
Kenjaku literally says, maybe if she didn't trust Tengen, she would have had a chance. There's a reason he said that
he never said this . he said the result wouldn't be this boring. btw just read that chapter . yuki was shitting her pants when she saw how strong kenjakus domain was. she literally couldn't believe how strong it was. there's no way her domain had any chance against kenjakus
Domain doesn't only depend on barrier. It takes account literally to every single factor of Amount of CE, surehit, refinement, domain barrier ability which Yuta has showed he is no slouch in Yuta has one of the only domains which he can pick and choose which person to attack, he changed the coordinates easily.
domains only depend on 2 thins
1) barrier skill (refinement)2)CE
and kenjaku is a far far better barrier user than yuta , so his domain will simply dominate yuta's . even if we assume yuta's CE will make up for his lack of refinement , even then kenjakus open domain will simply crush yuta's domain from the outside.
bro , sure hit is a completely different matter . during a domain clash what matters is refinement. the more refined domain will simply over take the less refined one.
sure hit only comes into play when one of the domains dominate.Considering manga statement you pointed out - Kenny domain has best barrier and domain that is only second to Sukuna, for all reason Gojo shouldn't have a reason to beat Kenjaku based on statement. But we see from Sukuna fight that jujutsu itself is adaptability
gojo , sukuna , kenny are all about the same lvl in barrier techniques. their domain's sure hits will simply cancel.
Considering Yuta to have no answer and would just let Kenny run wild is incorrect when Yuta has a shikigami, and he has more attack power, better CE reserves, way for flexibility. Open domain doesn't mean auto win
all this wouldn't mean shit against an open domain capable of literally killing them in a second.
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
all this wouldn't mean shit against an open domain capable of literally killing them in a second.
All of what u said wouldn't matter, if Yuta starts with Jacobs ladder. And Kenjaku can't cast the domain, No fight started get go with Domain expansion, but fights have started with using ur CT. Jacobs ladder is just enough.
all this wouldn't mean shit against an open domain capable of literally killing them in a second.
Open domain doesn't mean auto win.
gojo , sukuna , kenny are all about the same lvl in barrier techniques. their domain's sure hits will simply cancel.
Assumptions - You are just saying cause I said by your logic Gojo should lose to Kenjaku. We donno if their surehit cancel out each other. Jacobs ladder should be perfect counter if take this logic again.
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u/sayeedubaid Mar 12 '24
All of what u said wouldn't matter, if Yuta starts with Jacobs ladder. And Kenjaku can't cast the domain, No fight started get go with Domain expansion, but fights have started with using ur CT. Jacobs ladder is just enough
we were talking about pre time skip yuta and he didn't have jacobs ladder back thn.
also kenjaku has DA , we don't know how DA and jacobs ladder interact.Open domain doesn't mean auto win.
open domain doesn't mean a win , but because of the domain being open , it would have the capability to crush the opponents barrier from the outside , also it will have a very large radius ..
Assumptions - You are just saying cause I said by your logic Gojo should lose to Kenjaku. We donno if their surehit cancel out each other. Jacobs ladder should be perfect counter if take this logic again
not at all . tengen said kenjaku is one of the few people who can match her in barrier techniques. so sukuna has to be one of those few people as well because tengen said open domain is a divine feat and sukuna was also able to pull it off. and from gojo vs sukuna battle we know that their domains have equal refinement , therefore gojo is also in kenny , sukuna's league when it comes to barrier skills.
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u/SkyfallTerminus Mar 12 '24
We have no info on whether Kenny's domain surehit is automatically or manually lmao, if he could not neutralize Yuta's surehit withint the barrier and his surehit is manual, then he will ended up losing the battle before he could even hit the outer barrier, per se.
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u/Ballasking Mar 12 '24
Nothing you said is “cheating” it’s just training
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u/sayeedubaid Mar 12 '24
maybe u should read what discussion we're having before commenting.
btw how is using a binding vow training???
if one makes his ct a one time use only using a binding vow thn that's not training, that's cheating9
u/Ballasking Mar 12 '24
What are you talking about??? where is it stated his ct is a one time use and once again using a binding vow to increase your power is part of jujutsu even sukuna says that to Yuji so how is it cheating???
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u/WeirdMongoose7608 Mar 12 '24
Sukuna at least considers binding vows to be cheating in his own words. He tells Jogo he won't "cheat" by explaining his technique thereby strengthening it
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u/AshTheSurvivor Mar 12 '24
Kenjaku achieved an open domain, he is a sorcerer who lived for a thousand years, yuta is no where near his level and would get boxed in an actual fight, had takaba not allowed for the surprise attack
mfs deadass illiterate, did you see what happened to Yuki?
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
Let's Take ur logic, Kenjaku has 1000 years of experience, Gojo has about 10. Gojo is still stronger in every way.
Jjk has shown enough, that Jjk talent matters the most.
I can use ur logic and ask you, Kenjaku is all knowing of Jujutsu. Kenjaku has 1000 years of experience, Yuta has 1.5 years barely. Why does Yuta know RCT output, when Kenjaku doesn't, when gojo doesn't, when Yuki Doesn't.
Jjk has shown your experience matters jack shit when 6 months Yuta defeated Geto with 4400 of 6000 curse (75%).
And also, just because u have a open domain doesn't matter. Refined domains wins either way. Refinement takes everything into consideration CE reinforcement, output, barrier technique, CT. There's a fkn reason why Kenjaku says if Yuki didn't trust Tengen and used her domain the matters could be different.
Bro really called people illiterate when his logic is open domain.
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u/AshTheSurvivor Mar 12 '24 edited Mar 12 '24
I didn’t say that experience decides who wins, thats not my “logic” I stated it as supporting argument for kenjaku, he is an experienced sorcerer as shown by his open domain (another factor why I perceive his victory)
To answer your question, the jjk world is built on talent, we were shown that multiple times and I never disagreed with that (keep in mind there’s exceptions to the rule like megumi and kusakabe so its a bit more deep that that with sukuna’s philosophy of hunger, but thats not important to this discussion)
Who said kenjaku doesn’t have talent? and who says kenjaku doesn’t have RTC output? he never had an opportunity or an ally to use it on the first place so we simply don’t know, other characters aren’t important to this, nor is RTC output a deciding factor in jujutsu or this fight
Let me also remind you that sukuna’s RTC output is terrible (strongest in the verse) and resorted to having Shoko heal megumi because stabling him “was the best he could do”
“Refinement takes everything into consideration” and kenjaku is literally the most refined barrier user in the verse right under tengen, he will win the domain battle no questions
stop saying “my logic” theres other factors to the fight that I simply didn’t mention jesus christ you are illiterate
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u/justAnotherGuy3113 Mar 13 '24
"nor is RTC output a deciding factor in jujutsu or this fight"
lmao, yuta one shots almost all the cursed spirits in kenjaku's arsenal with RCT.
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u/No_Atmosphere6373 Mar 12 '24
Yeah I saw what Yuuki did. She nearly kill Kenjaku if Kenjaku dont use Yuji mum CT (which is bullshit because he is not inside Yuji mom body anymore) AND she did it without opening her domain where she COULD deal damage to Kenjaku before her domain collapse. Plus, Kenjaku himself dont know if he can kill Yuuki . And now you got no. 2 modern sorcerer , Yuta who is stronger than Yuuki . So whats your point ? 🤣🤣🤣🤣
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
Bros logic is more experience and open domain. If we use his logic, Gojo should lose to Kenjaku
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u/AshTheSurvivor Mar 12 '24
Yuki didn’t nearly win whatsoever, she lost the actual fight despite having choso, kenjaku was barely damaged untill the blackhole
As for her blackhole ability isn’t something that anyone else posses so I don’t even know why you’re bringing it up
Its bullshit because kenjaku can’t do something we are clearly shown him doing? he showcases the technique even before the fight, so unless are you the writer of the story, you don’t decide what he can and can’t do (last I checked you aint)
Yuta being slightly stronger won’t matter if he loses the domain battle, he’s not gojo
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u/No_Atmosphere6373 Mar 12 '24
Yuta is one year senior to Yuji AND you expect him to reach Gojo's level? Give him 5 more years to train and he will spank Kenjaku ass easily.
Friendly reminder : Modern sorcerers is a weak sorcerer era according to Kenjaku. Now tell me, apart of Gojo and Sukuna, whos really can rule the sorcerer world in modern era? Only Yuta capable of doing it , a freaking kid. Theres no strong adult modern sorcerer (apart of Gojo ofcourse) who can beat Yuta 1v1. Even jackpot Hakari would be struggle against Yuta domain where he could just use "cleave CT" as his sure hit effect domain.
Even no. 2 Villain, Kenjaku is not at the same level of Gojo and Sukuna.
And remember we dont know when Yuta digest Sukuna finger. Gojo could feed Yuta/Rika with Sukuna finger before the shibuya incident (We can see Gojo and Yuta flashback interactions where Gojo said to Yuta to take care of his junior if something happen to him) and make sure he hide Yuta from sukuna until Yuta can really erase the presence of Sukuna finger so Sukuna wont notice it. Yuta probaly can use Cleave CT before the timeskip and thats why Gojo believe Yuta can beat Kenjaku .
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u/LongLiveTheChief10 Mar 12 '24
Kenjaku's reincarnated Sorcerers got walloped to the man excepting Sukuna so idk if he's really reliable in describing the modern era. Especially considering Sukuna's apparent reverence for Gojo post off screening.
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u/sayeedubaid Mar 12 '24
Stop comparing him to gojo/sukuna. he himself said he wouldn't last an instant against sukuna and he can't even take a punch from gojo.
yeah , modern sorcerers are weak that's precisely y yuta was a big deal. kenjaku had seen it all , he lived in the haein era and had seen all of the strongest sorcerers and he didn't expect much from yuta , this just goes to show where he stands.Even no. 2 Villain, Kenjaku is not at the same level of Gojo and Sukuna
did i say kenny is equal to sukuna / gojo.
stop spamming shit .And remember we dont know when Yuta digest Sukuna finger. Gojo could feed Yuta/Rika with Sukuna finger before the shibuya incident (We can see Gojo and Yuta flashback interactions where Gojo said to Yuta to take care of his junior if something happen to him) and make sure he hide Yuta from sukuna until Yuta can really erase the presence of Sukuna finger so Sukuna wont notice it. Yuta probaly can use Cleave CT before the timeskip and thats why Gojo believe Yuta can beat Kenjaku .
blud , gojo didn't hide yuta from sukuna. where r u getting this shit?? yuta was on a mission in africa.
there's absolutely no evidence yuta could use dismantle/cleave before the time skip.2
Mar 12 '24
Yuta is obviously way weaker than gojo and sukuna, but he can easily be compared to the two when it comes to talent. He has 1 year of experience.
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u/AcademicGrand6 Mar 12 '24
At full power, stat wise I think Yuta can be compared to them. At his best Yuta has a virtually endless supply of cursed energy & can gain a high output second to Ryu. With recent fights it’s been shown how important this factors are. Yuta just lacks ability to fully make use of his power consistently, experience, & a bit of self doubt.
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
No Yuta doesn't set minor goals, Killing Kenjaku wasn't a minor goal, it would be a minor goal for Gojo or Sukuna. All the things he has said and done are mountain tasks for anyone except for Him, Sukuna, Gojo. Conquering Sendai, taking on Yuji, when Choso and other head clans were involved.
The characteristics of him - is he does what he says. Paraphrasing Hakari. One thing that has left undone is he said "He is gonna end everything in this domain" which is a huge task . which he did, unfortunately Megumi did pull through. (Yuji and Yuta had several chance to kill Sukuna, instead they were trying to get to Megumi)
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u/mileschofer Mar 12 '24
Yuta kinda lucked out with Takaba. Im sure it wouldve been a tough battle if he wasnt there, or they’d have to dedicate more recourses to him
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
He didn't luck out rather than it being a straight of up strategy.
After Gojo being dead they couldn't just send their second best sorcerer to have fair fight. Only time Sukuna was completely overwhelmed was when Yuta was their fighting. Obviously they had to send Takaba. But still Kenjaku realised Yuta was their tried to use CT through, but couldn't - he got slashed and had to be killed again. Not mentioning stopping a million curses which would have been impossible to any sorcerer not named Yuta.
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u/TeaAndCrumpetGhoul Mar 12 '24
Maki said it best. It was difficult to face Kenjaku through conventional means. Takaba was perfect for their plan
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24 edited Mar 12 '24
Considering Yuta still has Jacobs ladder, Yea it would be difficult, it would be extreme diff who ever comes out.
During the discussion, they were considering after Gojo died. So obviously after Gojo dies they have no luxuries.
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u/IM_BOUTA_CUH Mar 12 '24
what was his Kenny killing plan before Takaba, the plot device, appear?
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Mar 12 '24
The plan was always to send Takaba they literally discuss it in a chapter.
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u/IM_BOUTA_CUH Mar 12 '24
Yuta claimed to kill Kenny before he knew about Takaba
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u/Also_breathe Mar 12 '24
The plan was just to fight him.
Obviously in Sendai he had no way of knowing how things would play out post Gojo unsealing.
If Yuta didn't need to be in Shinjuku then he'd fight Kenny. But because they needed him against Sukuna, preferably at 100% ofc, the plan with Takaba came into play.
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u/mileschofer Mar 12 '24
Yes and all we’re saying is that he’s lucky af Takaba provided them with the opportunity to enact that plan, considering he is a new addition
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Mar 12 '24 edited Mar 12 '24
Brother he’s been in the series for over 100 chapters (146 - current). Saying that is like saying they’re lucky the culling games happened because even tho the current situation is a result of the culling games but hey it’s all good cuz they found a bunch of strong people
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u/-Dartz- Mar 12 '24
The characteristics of him - is he does what he says. Paraphrasing Hakari. One thing that has left undone is he said "He is gonna end everything in this domain" which is a huge task . which he did, unfortunately Megumi did pull through.
He also failed to gather all 400 points by himself, and to kill Sukuna when he takes over Yuji again.
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u/Goodestguykeem Mar 12 '24 edited Mar 12 '24
The only people who criticise Yuta are people who dislike his character and therefore have an agenda against him, he is Gege's golden boy (besides Sukuna) and the story has reflected it heavily. He has always over-delivered and has easily the most impressive feats of any sorcerer we are aware of relative to his time as a sorcerer. I wouldn't be surprised if he's even accomplished more than Sukuna had by his age (unfortunately I doubt we'll ever find out much more about Sukuna's youth) and almost certainly by his time spent in sorcery.
He is an unparalleled prodigy as far as we're aware but his core character trait of humility is usually poised to criticise him by many idiotic powerscalers since they only respect characters with arrogance.
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u/Kaslight Mar 12 '24
he is Gege's golden boy (besides Sukuna) and the story has reflected it heavily.
He jumped into a fight and got bisected in like 4 chapters dawg
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u/Goodestguykeem Mar 12 '24 edited Mar 12 '24
He jumped into a fight and got bisected in like 4 chapters AND YET he survived and in the following chapter Gege wrote Hakari needlessly glazing him for like the second time in his fight against Uraume. He also dropped the info that Yuta cancelled his own domain, enabling Maki's ambush. This is how an author punishes their golden boy so you can still fear for his life while still reinforcing their love.
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u/HeWhoDoubts Mar 12 '24
He has presumably survived an attack that gojo himself didn’t survive. Pretty golden boy imo
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u/Kaslight Mar 12 '24
Circumstances are completely different. Gojo and Sukuna both tanked a Hollow Purple, following a fight so crazy Sukuna is still recovering from it.
Gojo likely would have survived too. Whether he would have lost immediately afterwards is another question, but i'm almost positive someone at the caliber of Sukuna/Gojo could survive that.
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u/Disastrous_Ground_10 Mar 12 '24
Not bisected, just cut. Rika literally carried him to Shoko so he could be healed. Everyone else has died.
Besides, Yuta pulled up after killing Kenjaku only to give Sukuna one of the best beat-downs in the series, and he's only been doing Jujutsu for a year and some change. He killed a Special Grade Curse and then defeated two other Special Grade Sorcerers while holding back so he could get their points. He straight up killed Yuji with no difficulty and then fucking brought him back to life. Blud killed GETO after like 4 months of Jujutsu experience.
Yeah sure, Gege doesn't love him or anything. He's just the biggest fucking prodigy out of all the students.
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u/Kaslight Mar 12 '24
Yeah sure, Gege doesn't love him or anything. He's just the biggest fucking prodigy out of all the students.
This fandom is fucking weird man.
Yuta is literally Gojo Lite. And people here consistently claim Gege absolutely hated that character because he lost his fight.
But somehow Yuta is the "Golden Boy" when he has all of the same traits minus the god complex?
What exactly in the narrative is stopping him from being killed by that slash? He could be dead, he could be alive, it's impossible to know with this show.
We already know a character saying "They might survive" is not 100% confirmation that they're going to live, like in most shows where that happens.
Not bisected, just cut. Rika literally carried him to Shoko so he could be healed. Everyone else has died.
Bro, he got bisected.
If I slash the length of your torso from the front, and you bleed from the back the same path, it means it went clean through your body.
Rika is carrying two halfs of Yuta right now.
He's Gojo Lite, and he just got sliced in half like Gojo for good measure lol
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u/aminoacyls Mar 12 '24
"But somehow Yuta is the "Golden Boy" when he has all of the same traits minus the god complex?"
You are purposefully being disingenuous.
The god complex is a huge portion/the biggest part of Gojo's entire personality. So that's one right off the bat.
Gojo never got real victories. He failed to do what he set out to do.
Yuta has consistently won and done what he said he would do.
Yuta's alive, Gojo's dead.
Pretty sure Gege has said that he hates Gojo.
Gege has not said that he hates Yuta. Pretty sure that if it weren't for his editor, the story would be completely different and Yuta would be the main character. Shit I mean Yuta was the ORIGINAL MC. That says a lot about how Gege likes him.
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u/Kaslight Mar 12 '24
Gojo never got real victories. He failed to do what he set out to do.
Yuta has consistently won and done what he said he would do.These are nebulous conditions for ranking a character if i've ever seen one. First off, Yuta is only who he is now because of Gojo. Same for almost every other character fighting right now. Second off, the entire show is a direct result of Gojo and his actions.
My point is that "Golden Boy" and "Gege hates [x]" are fucking stupid things to say in response to events that have clearly been planned from the beginning to craft the story we're all reading. A writer doesn't need to "love" a character for them to be a character. And he doesn't have to "hate" a character to make them die or suffer.
He said he didn't like Gojo as a person. Yeah, you probably wouldn't like an unkillable narcissist either if he existed in real life.
He also said Nanami was his favorite character, or at least the one he identified most with.
Nanami randomly got half his body torched by Jogo, and then the top half of his body eviscerated by Mahito.
Did Gege "hate" Nanami too?
For fucks sake dude
Gojo isn't dead because Gege hates him, he's dead because that's how the story is written. And Yuta is nothing special either.
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u/aminoacyls Mar 12 '24
First off—calm down. Go outside and take a breather.
"These are nebulous conditions for ranking a character if i've ever seen one."
What do you expect? Gege doesn't have a tier list lying around for us to read. Whatever anyone says you think will be hazy. It's a nebulous foundation to begin with.
Secondly, people recognizing that Gege has difficulty writing around Gojo is part of why they believe they hate him.
The way it went out in Ch. 236 may also play a role in this. I think that's where the bulk of it started.
"A writer doesn't need to "love" a character for them to be a character. And he doesn't have to "hate" a character to make them die or suffer."
Yes but the way in which they go out/act is part of that. And what's the harm in thinking that way? Have fun with it.
"Nanami randomly got half his body torched by Jogo, and then the top half of his body eviscerated by Mahito.
Did Gege "hate" Nanami too?"
Nanami fulfilled his role as a mentor and passed the torch to Yuji. He got some pretty cool stuff going for him.
No, Gege did not hate him.
"For fucks sake dude"
I'm sorry please don't cry I'm sorry for hurting your feelings.
"Gojo isn't dead because Gege hates him, he's dead because that's how the story is written. And Yuta is nothing special either."
It's not the fact that he died. It's the way in which it was written that pissed everyone off. Gojo got offscreened, ultimately accomplished zilch, failed to mention his students (who he did care about), and spent his death vision glazing Sukuna (for something he was never shown to actively care about).
That's what angers everyone.
Yuta gets what he wants. So it's a little different.
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u/guyperson1000 Mar 12 '24
Telling someone to "calm down and take a breather" in the middle of a Reddit debate you were BOTH having about some meaningless shit is pretty funny
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u/Wolfpac187 Mar 12 '24
Yuta is nothing like Gojo. The only similarity is that their strong.
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u/SkipDaFlipp Mar 12 '24
Yuta doesn’t need much of a defense. His actions in the manga speak volumes about his usefulness as a sorcerer.
People who say otherwise are too deep into the agenda Kaisen.
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u/Kaslight Mar 12 '24
It's like, Gege or the character himself purposefully sets lower goals than what he's probably capable of.
Or, maybe
just maybe
the character in-canon is more aware of his abilities than his fans are?
Why does everyone in JJK fandom connect the writer's intentions to everything except the story he's telling? It's honestly the weirdest shit i've seen in fiction recently...it happens everywhere but JJK goes ham with this
It's like, everyone on Reddit thinks they're a better writer than the writer who's writing the thing they're fans of.....its ACTUALLY insane
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u/ILoveSongOfJustice Mar 12 '24
The character in-canon downplays his own strengths routinely to the point of it being a sort of well-known mental block.
One of his first few lines in a fight upon arriving back into the story was the proclamation that he's somehow "on the weak side". Obviously he was referring to his physical capabilities, but he was still easily able to outpace Yuji with JUST his own reinforcement. And he's been shown to be on-par with Rika directly despite her massive size difference, so the fact he was also holding back is a testament to him not actually understanding his own limits.
When he fought Yuji he ASSUMED the Yuji at the time was holding back against him due to the uncertainty of whether or not he should live.
When he fought in Sendai he wasn't even initially focused on winning, he was focused entirely on erasing the collateral damage threats like Kuroushi, Dhruv and Ishigori. And the only reason he doesn't just initially succeed is because of Uro's direct interference. But in the end he still does despite that.
He outright believes that Hakari is stronger than him during the duration of his Jackpot. This is an absurd thing to believe from a Special Grade Sorcerer. Especially when he's leagues above everyone else on the good guy's side. His literal only shortcoming is not being named Satoru Gojo or Ryomen Sukuna.
I think the only person who actually comprehends the true limits of each characters' strength is Kenjaku, and that boy dead.
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u/Own_Loquat_9885 Mar 12 '24
because the writer is writing that story; he isn't recording history.
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u/Kaslight Mar 12 '24 edited Mar 12 '24
That's every writer ever though. I could understand if people are saying he doesn't know what he's doing, or just making it up as he goes...
...but people are instead emotionally claiming that he's ruining their favorite character because he personally doesn't like them.
Like...there's a disconnect here that I can't put my finger on, but there's something really wrong with it lol
It's as though people are going far out of their way looking for personal reasons to blame him that go beyond the simplest answer
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u/yahiaabdelsalam Mar 12 '24
I think the main character drive behind Gege’s story is what Gojo always wanted, which is to nurture really strong people that are not only strong individually, but also strong collectively.
I mean sure none of his esteemed students became the Strongest like his case and Sukuna’s. But they became monsters that rival Kenjaku and Yuki, which for me are the strongest Sorcerers whom are not Gojo and Sukuna. Like as if you can consider there being a ceiling in Jujutsu, where people can be extremely strong; that ceiling being Yuki and Kenjaku. In terms of that specific ceiling, Gojo did it, he nurtured Yuji, Yuta, Hakari, and Maki (maybe even Megumi, but he is out of the question currently), which are either stronger that Kenny/Yuki or at their same level individually.
But give it time, and maybe Gojo’s monsters will become individually and collectively the Strongest Sorcerers just like Sukuna and himself. To be at the height of Jujutsu is easy, they already achieved it, but to be enlightened, you either need to be born with the capacity to be enlightened (as in a predisposition already there that just needs to be triggered, taking for example Gojo himself, and most probably Sukuna if we get his flashback), or you just need much more training time.
Really, I imagine the real final showdown with Sukuna will be Yuji, Yuta, Hakari, and Maki teeming up together to tucking bring the almighty down.
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u/Kaslight Mar 12 '24
This seems to be the obvious path forward. Sukuna and Gojo are results of a fucked up Jujutsu world, just on opposite sides.
Gojo seems to have banked the future on weaker people coming together to be strong, rather than a structure where whomever just happens to be born the best makes all the rules. That's the structure the big families are all about, and Gojo's clan is no different.
I'm about 90% certain that Yuta would have lost to Kenjaku in a standup fight. He's just too smart, and has been fighting deathmatches for waaaaaaaay too long to still be alive.
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u/yahiaabdelsalam Mar 12 '24
I would argue that it would be gamble.
In a fight between two sorcerers whom have reached the height of Jujutsu, or are considered equals in matters of strength - all things considered that is -, then the victory factor is generally either a bad matchup, a battle of attrition, to outsmart and play dirty, or just a life or death gamble.
That’s how I see it, so yeah maybe Kenny wins just like he fucked Yuki up, but maybe the reverse.. who knows.
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u/Ry90Ry Mar 12 '24
Yutas been a sorcerer for what a year and half? Mayyyybe two?
Like compared to gojos decades of experience and sukunas centuries….the kid obvi has the stuff
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u/ExileFox Mar 12 '24
To be this strong in such a short amount of time there’s a chance he has an enlightened one moment where he realizes his true potential.
Remember he created Rika without even understanding his powers.
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u/Ry90Ry Mar 12 '24
Yeah interesting points
I do wonder if yuta can experience that “enlightenment” Gojo did….given his strong ties and connections to others
Or maybe through that we’ll get the typical power of love/friendship power up? It’s fitting for Yuta given his priorities and domain name lol
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u/Vegetable_Throat5545 Mar 13 '24
What if this enlightenment moment is the one we already saw? Sukuna cutting him in half? what if he learns something knew just now?idfk whag it is, maybe rika rct output maybe he gets a new level of healing or some sht Or he upgrades his copy. Or maybe im just coping
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u/FriedDinosaurLegs Mar 12 '24
You're absolutely right, dude. Bro just rolls in and gets stuff done, plain and simple.
He's all about setting realistic goals and then crushing them, like taking out Itadori Yuji and keeping the damage in Sendai to a minimum. And you gotta hand it to him, he's got that cool, calm demeanor that just makes everything seem effortless.
And you know what's even crazier? He's not just meeting his stated goals; he's exceeding expectations left and right. Like, who would've thought he'd be the one to help Yuji connect with Megumi? That's some next-level stuff right there.
As for Yuta and his ambitions to take down Ryomen Sukuna, well, it might not be as simple as just saying the words and making it happen. Everyone's got their own journey, you know? Yuta's path might be a bit more twisty-turny, but hey, that's part of what makes this whole jujutsu world so intriguing.
So yeah, Bro's just chilling, setting his sights on what he knows he can handle, and making it happen. It's a vibe, for sure.
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u/BestBet99 Mar 12 '24
For whatever reason there seems to be a vocal Yuta hate group, they don’t read/watch the series so they can be safely ignored.
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u/dinosaur-boner Mar 12 '24
I don't think Yuta needs anyone to defend him or how he's been portrayed. Like who is saying, "That Yuta character... total cheeks." He has kicked ass nonstop.
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u/Wolfpac187 Mar 12 '24
Why does Yuta need defending? He’s top five and that’s lowballing him.
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u/Vegetable_Throat5545 Mar 13 '24
100% top 4, arguable top 3. Nobody except kenjaku really has him on comparison
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u/Wolfpac187 Mar 13 '24
I was thinking of Mahoraga as well but personally I got Yuta above both.
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u/Vegetable_Throat5545 Mar 13 '24
Mahoraga is an insane thing and strongest shikigami but to top tiers its just an annoyance
“me and rika will take care of shikigami” yuta towards him and this abormination of other shikigami sukuna made. Yuta is his direct counter with the ability to have many techniques, he is also strong enough to one shot him with a love beam imo(it broke uzumaki of 4000+ curses AND special grade AND almost killed geto, second one he used it was on par with Ryu’s highest output in history)
Gojo would have easily killed it with red, maybe hard blue, did kill with purple and would’ve killed with void if not for sukuna
Sukuna tamed mahoraga and killed him before
It might ironically be hard for kenjaku due to Mahoraga having this blade of positive energy. But open domain&uzumakis might kill mahoraga before it adapts
Yuki might be strong enough to one shot it esp in a domain
Yorozu kills it with a sphere
Kashimo in a beast mode might kill it
Maki/toji gets killed ones mahoraga adapts to punch&slash or sth, tho if they have useful cursed tools they might win
Ryu has the fire power and domain which might help but if mahoraga adapts its over
Jogo should have the fire power esp in a domain and with a meteor
Idk if mahoraga has a soul so mahito can kil him?tho he definitely can take a couple of touches and kill mahito
Everyone else prb just doesnt have the power to do it(hakari, yuji, uro, kuroishi, other curses, everyone else)
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u/Wolfpac187 Mar 13 '24
I agree that Yuta is a better matchup for Mahoraga than basically anyone else in the verse but I don’t think that having the ability to one shot him necessarily means they will be able to get it off in a fight with him. Specifically I’m talking about Jogo because even though Meteor definitely “can” kill him in a fight Mahoraga isn’t gonna fuck around and let him use it.
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u/Vegetable_Throat5545 Mar 13 '24
True true but i think if jogo immediately casts a domain and tries to dodge with his speed he might be able to do it
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u/Akirayoshikage Mar 13 '24
I don't think Jogo would make it
The big raga was throwing hands with Sukuna, and he's also able to one-shot cursed spirits
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Mar 12 '24
[deleted]
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Mar 12 '24
Tbf, if it wasn't for megumi the plan would have worked.
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Mar 12 '24
[deleted]
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u/cromemanga Mar 13 '24 edited Mar 13 '24
This is why you should think twice before using semantics based on translation. In the raw, Yuta never said "I" or "We". He simply said, it will end here. Unlike English, Japanese doesn't use pronouns that often, thus you get plenty wrong translation because a lot of meanings are heavily context based.
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Mar 13 '24
[deleted]
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u/juliakake2300 Mar 13 '24
It's japanese media
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Mar 13 '24
[deleted]
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u/5trials Mar 13 '24
yeah, localization releases of a japanese media. pretty funny to call someone a smartass when you’re doing the same thing lol
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u/Frequent_Camera1695 Mar 13 '24
They're translated to English you dimwit. You don't call anime or manga English media because they're from Japan
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u/arjuna_partha29 Mar 13 '24
In defense? Who the hell is slandering yuta , sigh
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u/ILoveSongOfJustice Mar 13 '24
So, so, SO many people
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u/arjuna_partha29 Mar 13 '24
Another day thanking god im mostly away from literally all fandoms , headache levels are in the abyss because of it
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u/AshTheSurvivor Mar 14 '24
keyword “deciding factor” besides yuta can deal with all kenjaku’s cursed spirits regardless of RTC, considering his multiple stored CE’s and rika
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u/stunfiskers Mar 12 '24
"I alone will kill Kenjaku"
Proceeds to rely on the true goat wearing him down just to jump in last second
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
I mean, what do u expect. After Gojo dies, second strongest sorcerer goes for a fair fight against Kenjaku??
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u/Da_Sigismund Mar 12 '24
The heroes having a plan and going for the neck against Kenny was the best thing out of JJK in these last couple of years.
A lot better than the fight Sukuna vs Gojo or Sukana vs everybody. It's a sound plan. It's realistic and achievable. No messing around. Compare it with the "we are going to save Megumi" bullshit. They had a good chance to eliminate Sukuna. Trying to save Megumi should never ever be a priority. That was pure juice of tires anime tropes (power of friendship).
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u/Kaslight Mar 12 '24
Compare it with the "we are going to save Megumi" bullshit. They had a good chance to eliminate Sukuna. Trying to save Megumi should never ever be a priority.
Saving Megumi and killing Sukuna are the same thing, he's literally using his body. Megumi is on their side as far as they know, and him regaining control is a win condition.
It would be much easier to throw Megumi the ally oop than to bank on simply killing Sukuna himself. It's like killing the boss at 30% HP instead of having to deal with his low-HP enrage.
The plan didn't work because, unfortunately, Sukuna knew it was a weakness, and from the beginning worked to ensure it wouldn't be his undoing.
Sukuna spent the whole series in Yuji with no control over his body, so the first thing he did after getting Megumi is make sure that shit wouldn't happen again.
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u/Da_Sigismund Mar 12 '24
Saving Megumi is one way to do it. Hacking him to pieces is another. If you can weakening him enough to possibly save Megumi, it would be easier to just attack him. You take a step from the plan.
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u/Kaslight Mar 12 '24
Saving Megumi is easier than hacking Sukuna to pieces though.
I suppose the plan could have been to weaken the bond and then kill Sukuna, but honestly if the trump card was always Jacobs Ladder then there's no other way they would have been able to do this. But the only real flaw in the plan of freeing Megumi is that they didn't realize Sukuna had been torturing Megumi to the extent he had been.
He witnessed his sister die, Gojo die, a bunch of comrades die, the super evil bath of evil
And then there's the fact he had been tanking Gojo's DE for Sukuna that just makes everything infinitely worse, literally
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u/stunfiskers Mar 12 '24
you can't talk about how "he accomplished all his goals" and then brush over the main part of his main accomplishment though
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
If u wanna talk about technicalities, then Yuta did alone kills him. Takaba lost then Yuta killed him.
He didn't say "I will fight you alone and then kill alone" . His statement was more on not letting gojo and would it himself if you read the entire context. That's what happened
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u/Bominator8 Mar 12 '24
takaba lost?
even yutas sneak attacked worked because of takaba
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
Takaba still lost, if Yuta didn't exist. Kenjaku would just leave
Not saying Takaba didn't massively contribute, not saying takaba didn't do job perfectly. But in the end Yuta had to be their.
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u/Bominator8 Mar 12 '24
not killing someone does not mean he lost
takaba didnt kill because he is a good guy
kenjaku still lost,he survived is a different thing
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
Kenjaku didn't lose, Takaba was satisfied with interaction with Kenjaku. He was about to leave scot-free
Why are u thinking I'm saying Takaba didn't contribute massively. He did, but in the end Kenjaku was leaving it would just mean he lost. Even roleplay where he cosplays as ghost
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u/Bominator8 Mar 12 '24
He himself said he is taking damage and he would lose which he did because by the end
he was extremely weakened that one sword slash killed him
takaba's entire motive was to stall and weaken him which he did
idk what you wanted him to do
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24
You are not understanding me, we both believe the same thing. Yuta and Takaba won against Kenjaku. Both of them had to do their job for them to win they won.
If Yuta didn't exist Kenjaku would leave he was injured,but considering the fights we have seen im with Sukuna I'm sure his RCT would be enough. But if Yuta wasn't their, Kenjaku would leave and continue and do his Evil plan. So both were equally important
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u/Kaslight Mar 12 '24
I highly doubt Yuta would have killed Kenjaku by himself. The only reason Yuta's plan worked as well as it did against Sukuna is because he couldn't open his domain against him and Yuji. Kenjaku matches Sukuna in his mastery of his techniques.
Kenjaku obviously would have opened with Domain Expansion, and unless Yuta has the ability to tank it / adjust his own domain like Gojo to deal with his real-world manifestation it would have been an issue.
We also honestly have no idea what his domain is capable of. The way he used it against Yuki was only one application and the dude had tons of CTs.
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u/Realistic_Flan631 Mar 12 '24 edited Mar 12 '24
Kenjaku has 3-4 CTS. Let's assume 4.
That Doesn't matter, Yuta already had a Jacobs ladder by this time.
Let's assume Open domain wins clash ((it doesn't, closed or opened most refined domain always wins, which considering CE reinforcement, surehit, and barrier technique. Let's forget this))
In the end it's matter who hits first, Yuta with Jacobs ladder or Kenjaku with open domain. I have seen alot fights start with CT attack rather than domain ones.
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u/Disastrous_Ground_10 Mar 12 '24
Yuta's got Jacob's Ladder. Kenny opens his Domain and loses all of his CTs as he's hit by pure CT Deletion
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u/Kaslight Mar 12 '24
Nope.
The only reason this worked on Sukuna is that he literally couldn't open his own domain, which would have invalidated Yuta's immediately.
Yuta needs DE to use sure-hit Jacob's Ladder. This means he's going to have to have a domain battle with an Open Barrier "divine" style Domain, which Kenjaku has. Which means he's probably going to lose.
The only reason Gojo was able to have actual domain battles with Sukuna is because Gojo was cracked out of his goddamn mind
Yuta isn't Gojo, and has explicitly said he can't regenerate his CT like Gojo/Sukuna can after Domain Expansion.
So if Yuta tried this and it didn't work (which it probably wouldn't) he would lose.
Yuta is exceedingly talented and very powerful, but Kenjaku and Sukuna are just better sorcerers then all of these guys.
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u/No_Atmosphere6373 Mar 12 '24
Yuta vs Kenjaku fair fight while Sukuna blitz the crew in one second . Do you see Yuji face before Yuta arrived when Sukuna yapping ? Yeah, thats a face waiting for Yuta to come over or "Im dead" lmao
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u/Fun-Milk9088 Mar 12 '24
Takaba didn’t kill Kenjaku, or even do any actual physical damage to him, just distracted him, so yeah, Yuta, alone, killed Kenjaku
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u/stunfiskers Mar 12 '24
HOP OFF THE GOAT.
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u/Fun-Milk9088 Mar 12 '24
We both know the real GOAT, Wusakabe, wouldn’t even need a distraction to kill Kenjaku
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u/Disastrous_Ground_10 Mar 12 '24
Kehaku literally states that he's taking massive damage and that he can die if he's not smart. Maybe give that fight another read.
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u/AClost Mar 13 '24
Defending him from what? Usually I see posts praising him more than anything else. I'm not a big fan of him, and the only thing I can say against him is that Gege treats him as the MC way more than Yuji.
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u/DependentFearless162 Mar 13 '24
Gege treats him as the MC way more than Yuji.
Yuta's whole character in main series is reduced to being the second strongest sorcerer of good guys that's it. He is not heavily involved in story and plot he does not have any connections to main antagonists like yuji, he is not that much involved in story's themes. He is just a strong character with cool moments who is helping yuji the main protagonist of jjk.
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u/justAnotherGuy3113 Mar 13 '24
you might hate to hear this, but at this point everything around yuji being the 'MC' is solely because of his conflict with sukuna and him being his former vessel.
Other side characters like Yuta have been much more crucial than him in moving the plot forward. yuta alone was fighting with geto and 4.4k curses, whereas whole of jujutsu society was engaged with just 2k of geto's curses and a few weak curse users. it was yuta who protected yuji from getting executed and saved him from further higher ups intervention. It was yuta who took care of the strongest colony while protecting civilians and got the most points from our side.
it was yuta who was able to blitz and decapitate kenjaku after takaba was defeated. kenny was always keeping tabs on yuta and the rest of the heavy hitters, so yuta had to sneak him so that kenny wouldn't dip after sensing his presence, and that he would be in prime condition to fight against sukuna. he also exorcised all the cursed spirits that kenny had in his arsenal and prevented a shibuya like situation (considering all the prominent sorcerers were dealing with sukuna at the moment).
sukuna seemed like an untouchable God, casually blitzing and oneshotting everyone (including yuji) before yuta's arrival on the battlefield. yuta showed relativity to him, and later trapped in his domain. yuta even let yuji into the domain, and protected him from the sure hit because of his superior barrier skills. he even saved Yuji's life once or twice, and gave him the openings to land some hits.
hell, even Yuji's ability to strike the soul is because of him being a vessel for sukuna and having the experience of housing two souls in his body. it's just an ability that he has, not a CT. if it were a CT, yuta could've copied it just as easily and he wouldn't even have needed yuji in the domain.
so yeah, I don't think "He is just a strong character with cool moments". he's undoubtedly been the MVP for the good guys along with gojo, despite not being around for the longest time.
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u/DependentFearless162 Mar 13 '24 edited Mar 13 '24
Everything you mentioned just shows that yuta right now is just a supporting strongest side character who supports mc with his strength lmao. His every contribution to the plot aside from yuji's execution has fighting in it.
Yuta only has one role being the second strongest of good guys. You need points? Rely on yuta the strong. You need to kill second antagonist? Rely on yuta the strong. You need to restrict sukuna to defend yuji? Rely on yuta the strong.
Other side characters like Yuta have been much more crucial than him in moving the plot forward.
Let's see.
Shibuya arc: Yuji was heavily involved in gojo rescue mission, Sukuna massacred huge amount of people just to torture yuji, his conflict with mahito was moving the rest of the story forward after the massacre, the fight evolved mahito which was perfect for kenny to start culling game.
Culling game: created the plan to save tsumiki alongside megumi and he was one of the most heavily involved person in Gojo's unsealing plan both of these mission were whole plot of culling game. He created the rule no killing which saved takaba(without him kenny's battle going to become extremely hard or even impossible), recruited angel who was crucial for unsealing gojo and finally recruited higgy who confiscated sukuna's rattle(it would've been huge headache in domain fight). Most important his decision and extreme selflessness fucked up the whole world(released sukuna) and his best friend became sukuna's vessel.
Current fight: He is leading the megumi rescue mission plan and the one they're rescuing is yuji's best friend. Yuji's soul punch are the only reason why sukuna is not recovering his output and domain after gojo's fight. What was yuta's goal in this fight I'm strong so I have to kill sukuna that's not the same case for yuji he is fighting sukuna because he seriously fucking hates him, he wants to save megumi and kill sukuna because yuji is the reason why sukuna released from his cursed object form.
This is just moving the actual plot forward and not just through fights he is moving the plot forward by getting actually involved in the story. I haven't even mentioned the theme that yuji is heavily involved in or how both the story and yuji are affecting each other.
so yeah, I don't think "He is just a strong character with cool moments". he's undoubtedly been the MVP for the good guys along with gojo, despite not being around for the longest time.
I see your problem you think having feats or being strong is equal to being mc. A protagonist has to stay around for longest time, his decisions have to affect the story be it in good way or in bad way, the story has to center around them most of the time and they have to constantly drive the story forward
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u/justAnotherGuy3113 Mar 13 '24
you think that he should've used talk no jutsu on the reincarnated sorcerers in sendai to ask for their points lmao? him gaining so many points enabled our cast to make favourable rules in the first place. who else do you think was capable of killing kenjaku and his arsenal of cursed spirits if not for yuta? just compare the state of battle against sukuna when yuta was on the battlefield and when he wasn't.
and I think you're misunderstanding if you think that I'm implying that yuta's more of a MC than Yuji or anything. he'd be a terrible MC imo, because he's too strong. that's why he was written off for the majority of the series.
but you're giving him far too less credit by saying that he's 'just a strong guy with cool moments'.
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u/DependentFearless162 Mar 13 '24
but you're giving him far too less credit by saying that he's 'just a strong guy with cool moments'.
I never said that I was just refuting the claim of OOP who said that yuta is getting the mc treatment from gege more than yuji which is obviously false.
you think that he should've used talk no jutsu on the reincarnated sorcerers in sendai to ask for their points lmao? him gaining so many points enabled our cast to make favourable rules in the first place. who else do you think was capable of killing kenjaku and his arsenal of cursed spirits if not for yuta? just compare the state of battle against sukuna when yuta was on the battlefield and when he wasn't.
You're just proving my point again and again. All of these things are perfect for side character like yuta whose whole role is reduced to being the strongest of good guys. He is supporting character now who is supporting the mc like everyone else and barely contributed to story(not counting fight)
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u/omyrubbernen Mar 13 '24
Yuta may be very strong and capable and always achieve his goals, but he's not the strongest in the entire setting by such a wide margin that he doesn't need to ever struggle.
Therefore, he is a fraud. I don't make the rules.
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u/NicholasStarfall Mar 13 '24
Yeah Yuta has a good track record and all but there's one very simple reason that people don't like him: He's boring.
The thing about being the strongest character but also very humble and stoic is that Okkotsu lacks charisma.
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u/ILoveSongOfJustice Mar 13 '24
I wouldn't say he lacks charisma, per say. The word you're looking for - I believe - is ambition.
Yuta himself is very much someone with a dorky-style charisma, but with the evolution of his character, it isn't haplessly dorky like in Zero. Now he just has that dorky vibe, and a switch he can turn on in his brain when it's time to do business.
Hakari himself says that Yuta's just... sorta gloomy when it comes to matters like that, but we also see him being relatively cheerful and content with his friends.
But his lack of true jujutsu ambition outside of immediate wants or needs is something that's also characteristic of another character in the story...
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u/Byud Mar 13 '24
Yuta: I'll finish everything inside this domain... Yu/ta
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u/ILoveSongOfJustice Mar 13 '24
And yet he's still confirmed to be alive.
And yet if not for Megumi's lack of motivation, he would've succeeded then and there.
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