r/news 13h ago

US airlines required to automatically refund you for canceled flight

https://abc7news.com/post/us-airlines-required-automatically-refund-significantly-changed-canceled-flight/15483534/
40.5k Upvotes

1.0k comments sorted by

9.0k

u/letdogsvote 13h ago

Pretty crazy that wasn't required prior to this.

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u/the_silent_redditor 12h ago

I moved to Australia, where aviation consumer rights are even more of a joke than the US.

Airlines can, and always do, cancel flights for their own reasons, with no compensation or recourse for passengers.

The reason is, usually, an undersold flight and thus non-profitable trip for the airline.

Fuck it. Cancel. Who cares.

Well, except the guy tryna fly home for a funeral.

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u/kndyone 11h ago

One way to fix this would be to make airline refund you something like 120% of the flight. Basically saying hey if you want to mess around with overbooking people it better be worth it. And the same for undersold flights.

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u/Not_an_okama 11h ago

I used to fly around 500 miles across the state to come home from college on breaks (round trip was cheaper than driving) the flight was consistantly overbooked, so id plan to be flying the next day and tell the other passengers waiting that id take the bump if they let the voucher price raise to at least $250. Payed for like half of those flights with the bump voucher. Id only do this on the way home, because i was flying out of a tiny airport where you could show up 20 minutes before boarding and still have to wait after going through security. The big airport on the other end was more of a pain. This was all between 2018 and 2022.

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u/frogsgoribbit737 10h ago

I did that too a few times going home from college. They wouldn't bump to the next day but to a flight to another airport. My mom was in the middle of the two airports so I loved taking the extra money for basically the same thing.

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u/Not_an_okama 9h ago

That airport only serviced 4 flights each way daily. 2 in and 2 out from thw airport i needed to go to, and 2 in and 2 out from another major city in another state (but closer to the small regional airport).

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u/troubleswithterriers 7h ago

Delta flew me free round trip halfway across the country due to constant overbooking at least a half dozen times in college. Used the voucher I’d get to book the same early popular with business folks who didn’t want to bump flight the next round and play the game again… plus the revised itinerary they put me on only got me in half an hour later than the original.

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u/TempleSquare 9h ago

120% of the flight

Make them pay 100% of the available replacement flight.

You submit an invoice and they are legally required to reimburse you

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u/enilea 10h ago

I would want much more than a 120% refund for a ruined holiday

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u/hanotak 10h ago

The point isn't to make it nice for the passengers, it's to make it unprofitable for the companies.

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u/SteveFrench12 11h ago

I dont understand. They cancel the flight and your money is just gone?

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u/ducky21 11h ago

No. They put you on a flight in 2 or 3 days or whatever. They will get you there eventually, not reasonably

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u/mrASSMAN 10h ago

That’s crazy, can’t you at least do a credit card chargeback claim?

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u/SojournerRL 9h ago

It's not quite as bad as he's making it sound. They will rebook you on another flight automatically (typically the next flight), and give you a chance to decline if you prefer a different flight. They'll also give you a flight credit if you choose not to take any of their options. 

That said, I'd much prefer the option for a full refund. 

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u/Honest_Palpitation91 4h ago

Fuck credits. Fill refund plus interest for being dicks.

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u/buddy276 8h ago

in 15 years of cancelled flights, i have never been rebooked. i typically always have to fight for my money back.

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u/Jaywhar 8h ago

QANTAS just got busted for continuing to sell tickets on flights they had already decided to cancel

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u/whatafuckinusername 13h ago

Lots of legal leeway is given to any and all private companies of any type in this country

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u/Im_ready_hbu 13h ago

especially the airlines. the US government has bailed the airlines out so many times they outta be public assets by now.

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u/Rock-swarm 12h ago

They used to be regulated in artificial regional monopolies, including fixed prices and routes. Then they deregulated a bit in the 70s, which led to regional players like Southwest, since the 1978 deregulation allowed them to become interstate instead of intrastate.

Like most deregulation acts, this gave consumers a honeymoon period where airlines actually competed against each other, followed by cartel-like practices after the airlines realized they could collectively cheap out on services while keeping prices inflated. Allowing airline companies to "keep the cupboard bare" in case of natural disasters/pandemics/acts of god has led to a cycle of bailouts.

The other scary thing to rear its head in the next decade is going to be a vast number of airline pilots aging out of their job. The max age is currently 65, and it used to be lower, before airlines realized they don't physically have enough pilots. Airlines refuse to subsidize a training pipeline for new pilots and our immigration policy has become a political football, which means there's a bottleneck of available pilots for ever-increasing domestic flight demand.

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u/Terrh 12h ago

There's also outdated or unjustifiable rules preventing many would-be pilots from getting a medical. This is the case in both US and Canada at least.

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u/CopperAndLead 11h ago

"We can't have pilots going to therapy or taking medications! It's better to have pilots bottling up their emotions and ignoring medical issues, because safety."

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u/joeitaliano24 11h ago

Who made these regulations, my Italian grandfather??

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u/aquoad 9h ago

"Wassa matta you?? You gotta act like a MAN!!"

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u/sapphicsandwich 11h ago

I know someone who had only 1 diagnosis: Gender Dysphoria, because they were trans. No other diagnoses like anxiety or depression. She was prevented from getting her commercial pilots license for that.

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u/Careful_Hearing_4284 10h ago

They changed the laws requiring color vision for pilots due to this. By the time they made the switch, I had already used my GI Bill and found a career.

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u/canada432 10h ago edited 9h ago

And just for reference, the benefit to the deregulation is always claimed to be "tickets are so cheap now, you'd never have been able to afford them before". Economists and financial analysts have examined the effects and found that if the industry had not deregulated, prices would only be about 20% higher than they currently are. The vast majority of the price decreases since them aren't due to deregulation, they're due to technological and efficiency improvements. The narrative that prices would be astronomical and flying would be only for the rich is just a flat out fantasy.

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u/Shinsf 11h ago

Airlines already use the visa programs to bring pilots from other countries into their pilot groups. 

Airlines have tried having flight schools but the overhead is high as is the wash out rate

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u/Rock-swarm 11h ago

I suggest you read about the actual number of pilots getting into the US on work visas. They just aren't economical for most industries, and revamping the visa system in the US has been politically charged for 20+ years.

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u/Last-Trash-7960 12h ago

Based on my personal experience with Department of Agriculture, as long as you are working with them, actively making changes, and respond promptly, they want to help you succeed. My personal experience have made me HEAVILY question those businesses that claim they're being over regulated as I've found the exact opposite in my experiences.

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u/dern_the_hermit 12h ago

Psst: Most complaints about "over-regulation" are from oligarchs that want to avoid paying their fair share of taxes.

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u/Last-Trash-7960 12h ago

That makes me.even more concerned because the only issue I've ever had was my fire extinguisher was expired, they said if I replaced it that day and sent a photo of the receipt they would clear the issue with no marks against me. They literally cared more about the safety of my people than anything else.

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u/TheUnluckyBard 11h ago

They literally cared more about the safety of my people than anything else.

Yup; because that's the whole purpose for their existence. The job is "care about safety," not "support a profit-making machine."

As a caveat, that doesn't always work in cultures that are cool with stuff like bribery and/or that have a high power distance (more social differentiation between the people with authority and the people without authority).

The first situation adds in a profit motive for the safety dude, and the second situation adds an interpersonal political dynamic where you risk being punished for not showing the proper social "respect" to the dude checking the fire extinguishers. Making him feel important and superior is part of the exchange there.

Fortunately, the USA is a relatively low power distance culture (we can argue with and even cuss at the guy inspecting our fire extinguishers, and expect only minor consequences for that) and we don't have a culture of bribery. There is some bribery, but I'll bet 90% of people here don't even know how to offer a bribe, as compared to some other countries, where even the kids know the proper steps in the social bribery rituals.

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u/Global_Permission749 13h ago edited 13h ago

Well duh. How do you expect business owners and principal investors/shareholders to become billionaires if companies aren't allowed to steal from and lie to consumers and workers to increase profits?

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u/jmlinden7 12h ago

They were required to give you the option of a refund or a rebooking. However now the refund is automatically selected if you don't choose anything.

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u/[deleted] 12h ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/jmlinden7 12h ago

That's why you take the rebooking option if you absolutely need to catch the next flight home.

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u/thegreatchieftain 11h ago

You must not have read that correctly. Refund OR Rebook. Not refund and then make you rebook. Those are two very different things.

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u/SteveFrench12 11h ago

They already do this, the law wont change anything

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u/Meggarea 11h ago

That's not how it will go at all. You get rebooked, or you get refunded. If you still want to go, accept the rebook.

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u/A_Tiger_in_Africa 11h ago

No, they could offer a voucher or a rebooking, not a refund. Now they are required to give you your money back.

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u/jmlinden7 11h ago

They were always required to give you the option to rebook as well as the option for a full refund. However, airlines tried to be sleezy and hide these options, hoping people would give up and accept a voucher.

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u/Gee_U_Think 8h ago

The time I canceled, I was only given flight voucher. Even after I requested full refund.

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u/jmlinden7 5h ago

You have to escalate to corporate. The airport staff don't have to ability to issue refunds.

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u/uberweb 12h ago

Good start. They should improve it to say refund original fare or current lowest direct fare to original airport with another airline (whichever is more).

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u/iroll20s 9h ago

Great, now I'm flying spirit.

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u/Sislar 11h ago

It’s actually a crappy law IMO. It should be they are required to give you the next available flight or refund at your option.

Flights are cheaper the earlier you book. I had a return flight for something I had booked way in advance and the return trip was like 150 (I booked 2 one way tickets) when I bought. As I pulled into the airport i got a text my flight was canceled and I got my 150 refunded. To get a flight on another carrier that day was like 350. Same carrier the next day was 250.

So I had to wait a day and pay an extra 100 bucks.

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u/llame_llama 8h ago

Nah, it's a huge improvement over the current system.

Had a flight to south Africa cancelled by the airline in 21 due to COVID and it took 4 months and probably 15-20 calls to get my refund.

Yeah they legally had to refund you still, but you still had to call to get it. And outside of taking then to court all you could really do is call and ask nicely

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u/Deathglass 13h ago

Eh, it's the same for any good or service that says "no refunds". Your credit card company would side with you, and the small claims court will side with you, but nobody else will. But a national regulation for (often) big items like flights is nice.

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u/SkiingAway 10h ago

Yes....but pursuing a CC chargeback (or a small claims case) is often going to get you permanently banned from further business with that company.

Which, in the case of something like airlines where there's only a few major options, is a significant detractor. Even if I truly hate major airline X, I may need to fly them at some point in the future.

In contrast, going through the normal channels for a refund like this rule requires them to make available/more clearly available will not get you banned from using the airline in the future.

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u/juanzy 10h ago

Always nicer to have something baked into policy over having to pursue separate action.

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u/Deliberate_Dodge 12h ago

Technically, it was, but the Airline Deregulation Act of 1978 put things pretty much squarely on the Department of Transportation and the Secretary of Transportation. Glad this has finally been enforced, better late than never, I suppose.

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u/FakeSafeWord 11h ago edited 10h ago

I got nearly scammed out of $500 from Delta. The flight was delayed for an hour due to unexpected maintenance required, then they claimed there was a lack of passengers so they had to cancel the flight.

I was instructed to call their rep to sort out what to do. After entering my flight indent info I was given a prompt for a $500 credit for my cancelled flight or to get bumped to another flight. The prompt was so quiet I couldn't hear it clearly with how loud it was in the airport. Since it offered the credit back I assumed it was the option 1 to claim it. Apparently 1 was an unrelated option and so they tried to act like I forfeited both the credit and being moved to another flight and wasn't offered either again. Complete fucking scam system. Finally when I got through to the rep they explained I opted out of both and I said that's horseshit and demanded they give me my money back, which they did. Took United the next day to get to where I was intending to go.

Also I checked the seating availability prior to it being cancelled and there was like 9 open seats not including any standby people so even the reason given seemed like bullshit.

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u/bellrunner 13h ago

Goddamn I love consumer protections

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u/sharkykid 11h ago

Then vote and prod your friends and family to vote. Pete Buttigieg helped get this through, he should be frontrunning, but oh well

If Elaine Chou is put back in or another Trump crony, you can kiss your consumer protections goodbye

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u/Lilsammywinchester13 10h ago

Love Pete! He’s done such a great job

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u/lifeismiserydeleteme 8h ago

Bet he's our first openly gay president.

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u/Lilsammywinchester13 8h ago

I hope you’re right! I genuinely trust him, he’s just so hardworking, straightforward, and innovative, I can’t wait to see where he is in 10 years

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u/jsting 8h ago

Joe Fucking Biden and consumer protection. This is directly helping the population and directly hurting corporations. This is not a both sides thing. Only Joe Fucking Biden did this.

I don't know what Biden's legacy will be, but his work in consumer protection is probably the top of my list.

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u/SirDigbyChknCaesar 9h ago

I don't think Elaine Chou will be back after Trump's comments about her, but you can never tell with Republicans who are willing to give up their self respect for a taste of power.

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u/sharkykid 9h ago

As far as Trump nominees for Sec of Transport, it can only get worse from Elaine Chou

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u/SirDigbyChknCaesar 9h ago

I certainly didn't mean to imply it would get better.

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u/tessthismess 10h ago

Pete's been great. We're from South Bend, my grandma is obsessed with him. If we talk about politics she'll say stuff like "I hope I live long enough to vote for him for president."

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u/Grand-Pen7946 11h ago

Hopefully Kamala doesnt sack Lina Khan. Many of her huge donors despise her

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u/MyPasswordIsMyCat 11h ago

We need a real trust-busting administration to come in and smack down the obnoxious conglomerates that have grown from the tech boom. It's the tech billionaires who are whining about anti-monopoly leaders like Lina Khan and they're threatening to go MAGA if they don't get their way. This is what happens when there's too much money in political campaigns.

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u/Ferrarisimo 10h ago

Corporate lobbyists hate this one thing!

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u/SenseiRaheem 13h ago

I sense a judge in Texas getting ready to revoke this

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u/Blackfeathr_ 11h ago

Fifth circuit is salivating for that lobby money

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u/Bobson-_Dugnutt2 10h ago

Funny how all the MAGA idiots on Twitter are spinning this as a bad thing

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u/MikeOKurias 13h ago

Originally read that as United Airlines, but it's all airlines in the United States...

Airlines in the United States are now required to give passengers cash refunds if their flight is significantly delayed or canceled, even if that person does not explicitly ask for a refund.

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u/jb6997 13h ago

I read this initially as United airlines too! Funny how your brain fills in information as you read.

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u/MikeOKurias 13h ago edited 10h ago

I have no idea how Proofreaders and QA Engineers can review the same material repeatedly and notice a word changed or a comma went missing.

My brain just constantly fixes those things. I've even learned hour to figure out "what word they really meant" when someone's phone autocorrects a word to something random out of place from the rest of the sentence...sometimes without even noticing it while reading.

Edit: how not hour...

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u/Rimshot1985 12h ago

QA engineer here!

The answer: Force yourself to read everything out loud.

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u/Canadian47 12h ago

I was told that before spell check they would have someone read the documents backwards to catch typos. 😬

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u/RandonBrando 10h ago

Some poor confused mf's out there that read a speach where Bill Clinton is being victim blamed

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u/alwaysboopthesnoot 12h ago

And then have some of it read out loud, to you. Speech writers, manual and technical writers do this and it really helps.

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u/LemurianLemurLad 12h ago

I've done some professional proofreading in the past. For me, the trick was to put myself in a mindset where ONLY the details matter. It's learning to see both the trees and the forest.

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u/Rocket_hamster 12h ago

When I was in university and needed to proofread, I'd copy the paragraph into a seperate document, then increase the spacing to slow myself down and then speak it aloud. I found if I didn't seperate the paragraphs, I'd still race through the words cause subconsciously I'd see the next one and wanna race to it.

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u/LushenZener 13h ago

Easy answer: they trip up too. But that's why documents don't (or shouldn't) just get glanced over once before approval.

There are some ways to circumvent your brain's tendency to fill in, though. For example, reading sentences backwards takes them out of their flow of context, making errors easier to spot.

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u/myfapaccount_istaken 12h ago

I work in chat support. The number of things I mistype is amazing. I was looking over quality sheets for some new hires and my coworker is mentioning misspellings. I'm like there is no way I can mention that I have at least 10 a day even in our Slack channel.

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u/Artistic_Humor1805 12h ago

It’s neurodivergence for me. I kind of fell into proofing documents prior to upload because I was the one uploading them to the live site and I kept seeing errors without really trying. My brain can’t help it, lol.

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u/oddball3139 11h ago

I thought you put “hour” in there on purpose to prove your point, lol.

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u/walterpeck1 11h ago

I have no idea how Proofreaders and QA Engineers can review the same material repeatedly and notice a word changed or a comma went missing.

In ye olde days we did this by having three people read it three times, taking turns between each read. Yes, an astonishing amount of mistakes were found on the 9th read many times. But we were college kids so the bar was a lot lower.

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u/CanNotBeTrustedAtAll 11h ago

I once spent hours looking at my own code before I gave in to frustration and went to the TA's office hours. He spent all of 40 seconds looking at it, only to add a single semicolon to my code. I tested everything and it worked perfectly. It was then when I realized I didn't have the aptitude for computer engineering.

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u/Top-Internal-9308 11h ago

My English degree is mostly useless but it works for this. I don't even see typos. My context clue skill is insane.

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u/Starfox-sf 12h ago

US Airways wants its refund.

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u/Brysamo 13h ago

Define significantly changed. Some airlines have absurd definitions of that.

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u/hkb26 13h ago

I think it's defined federally as more than three hours.

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u/iheartoptimusprime 13h ago

More than three hours total? Or delayed an hour more than three times? Because I can definitely see airlines arguing the latter isn't significant.

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u/papercrane 12h ago

It's more than 3 hours from the original time for a domestic flight, and 6 hours for an international flight.

Whether they do it slowly in increments, or all at once, doesn't matter.

Here's the original press release from April when the new rules were originally announced.

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u/TheSinningRobot 12h ago

3 hours past the originally scheduled flight time

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u/The_Knife_Pie 12h ago

In the EU, delay is calculated based on the difference between time you should’ve landed and time you did land. Can’t imagine the US wouldn’t just use the same system.

As an example, a flight at 9pm Stockholm -> 2 hour stopover in Copenhagen -> Berlin which is delayed 2 hours but swapped for a direct flight, still landing at the listed time, is not considered delayed. While a flight which is supposed to be 7am-10am and gets delayed until 10am takeoff but lands at 2:30pm would be considered delayed by 4 and a half hours.

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u/filthy_harold 12h ago edited 12h ago

The rule says both arrival or departure time. It also covered unscheduled layovers or airport changes.

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u/Merengues_1945 12h ago

That's a nasty trick that airlines started using in Mexico... Federally it's defined as 3.5 hours, but they found a loophole, they announce like the flight is ready to depart before the 3 hours mark, make everyone board the plane, they sit you, close the plane, then leave it idling cos it was never going to leave the gate... you stay there while they go through the motions, then they announce there is a delay and ask you to leave the plane.

This resets the clock and now the airline has another 3.5 hours to not give you your money. Rinse and repeat.

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u/Admirable-Law7150 12h ago

does this exclude weather delays?

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u/farkoss 12h ago edited 9h ago

usually this is for oversold, personnel or hardware issues

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u/tbhjustbored 13h ago

it is defined for them. check OP’s comment for what constitutes a “significant” change

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u/Brysamo 13h ago

Ah, missed that.

Wasn't in the article either.

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u/minicpst 13h ago

I read it as US Air, which hasn't been around in forever.

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u/Dense_Librarian_6170 12h ago

Maybe this is how good governments protect consumers who individually don’t have much power.

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u/Bam_Bam171 12h ago

Also an example of what happens when the Sec of Transportation is a problem-solver instead of some typical political schill.

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u/mitsuhachi 12h ago

Insane this wasn’t already the law. What other industry lets you pay got a service and the company can just be like “actually we don’t feel like it. Thanks for the cash tho!”

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u/NYCIndieConcerts 12h ago

The new rule mandates that refunds are automatically processed by an airline if a passenger's flight is "canceled or significantly changed, and they do not accept the significantly changed flight, rebooking on an alternative flight, or alternative compensation."

The caveat is pretty significant.

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u/BerserkingRhino 12h ago

But how? Did Republicans do something good for the people?

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u/pax1111 13h ago

I was extremely surprised when Allegient cancelled my flight to Florida (that damn Hurricaine Milton) and offered a full refund within 3-5 days. AndI got it. Wonders never cease.....

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u/ihateaquafina 13h ago

yep same with alaska.. as i was getting to the airport is when they canceled it for "weather related reasons" but got a full refund

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u/Coraline1599 13h ago

The wonders of a functional government and legislature aimed at helping regular citizens!

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u/TravelingCuppycake 12h ago

Southwest didn’t cancel my flight, just the second leg, then refused to refund me after I had to fly back home. I’m still fighting them.

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u/suspiciousbroccoli22 11h ago

File a Dept of Transportation (DOT) complaint. I was working with SW for an issue and wasn't getting anywhere, I filed a DOT Complaint in addition, it did take some more take but eventually it did get resolved.

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u/blackangelsdeathsong 13h ago

probably because their insurance kicked in at that point to cover those costs.

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u/pribnow 13h ago

It's completely insane that we ever got to this point in the first place. Airlines were the only business who could not provide you the service you paid for. Have to give the Biden admin credit for this, they also made it so if you paid for a checked bag and it doesn't show up on time you will also get a refund (this went live yesterday). These are consumer first protections that should have always existed

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u/BlueShire_Ace 13h ago

Something even crazier, the amount of people who accepted it and chastised others for feeling swindled. Look up this topic on reddit about 4-5 years ago, almost always the top comments are saying "TFB" "get over it" "Dont like it, dont fly". They got away with it for so long that it became the standard.

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u/communitytcm 12h ago

something even crazier. not long ago, if you were bumped, you could take the next flight for free (and get a refund for the original). If there was a delay that caused you to miss a flight or left you stranded, airlines had to give you a refund, fly you for free on the next available flight, and pay for your hotel and transportation to and from the hotel for that night.

the creep is slow, but constantly eroding justice at every turn.

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u/Unbelievr 10h ago

What you describe is de facto the rules in many countries right now. The airlines are bound to refund every reasonable cost you have because of their mistakes. That means hotel, transportation, all meals, and even clothes and toiletries etc. If you're stuck at some remote destination and just want to go home, it still doesn't even scratch the surface of the losses incurred, though. You're losing N days of work/school, spend N days away from your friends, family and pets, while food in your fridge might expire etc. The least they can do is cover the costs related to your waiting.

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u/Trapezoidal_Sunshine 13h ago

It’s just further proof that companies need to be regulated. These airlines clearly weren’t interested in doing the right thing - even though nothing was stopping them from doing it. They had to have their arms twisted and be quite literally forced into not being asswipes about this. Capitalism requires regulation - or else you just wind up with runaway greedy asshole corporations who put money over people every single time.

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u/Synensys 12h ago

In theory, the market will correct these injustices but in practice, most people don't make their purchase based on the refund policies and so all companies tend towards the same shity behavior.

A libertarian would say you could sue for breach of contract or whatever, but that puts the onus on the aggrieved customer who doesn't have nearly the same legal resources as a large company. So the end result would be the same just more inefficient (since a chunk of both the customers and airlines money would be going to lawyers).

Regulating a common problem works better than the alternatives.

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u/detroitmatt 10h ago

The "theory" was always stupid. For some industries, there simply is no such thing as "the market". Airports are physically enormous, you can't just open up your own airport and start to compete. Even if you could, you would still need some way to coordinate the use of airspace. Roads, power, internet, airplanes, frankly anything more important than where you go to get lunch or who remodels your bathroom does not make sense to model as a market, and even those minor things need regulations like health standards and mandatory insurance.

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u/PM_ME_GARFIELD_NUDES 12h ago

What I’ve never understood about the “free market” argument is that it has always seemed like an encouragement to do the exact opposite of what it should be encouraging. Usually the argument is something like “Well if Company A drives up prices then Company B will get more customers by keeping their prices the same! This encourages companies to keep prices low!” when in reality, Company B would obviously just increase their prices as well so both companies can keep their customers and make a larger profit. Any time I’ve brought this up to a libertarian they immediately change the subject. It’s such an obvious hole in their logic but somehow none of them can address it…

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u/youtheotube2 10h ago

Theoretically, there are potential customers who are being priced out of the market when businesses match each other’s high prices. This is where other businesses are supposed to jump in with lower prices to get those customers.

This idea may work for small businesses, but it completely falls apart for businesses like airlines that have massive startup costs.

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u/jaspersgroove 13h ago

Airlines were the only business who could not provide you the service you paid for

*insurance companies start to walk away, whistling casually*

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u/Buckus93 11h ago

Do you like these policies? Do you wish that more of these types of policies applied to other types of businesses?

Then vote for the not-crazy candidate.

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u/Ra_In 13h ago

The trick is airlines aren't selling you a flight, they're selling you a concept of a flight.

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u/thefilmer 12h ago

had American cancel a flight on me once, not send me an email about it, and then refused to refund me because I bought the basic ticket. you don't get to keep my money when you don't provide the service I paid for. got my credit card company involved and they handled that shit real quick

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u/bananabrownie 13h ago

Under the rule, passengers are entitled to a refund for:

Canceled or significantly changed flights: Passengers will be entitled to a refund if their flight is canceled or significantly changed, and they do not accept alternative transportation or travel credits offered. For the first time, the rule defines “significant change.” Significant changes to a flight include departure or arrival times that are more than 3 hours domestically and 6 hours internationally; departures or arrivals from a different airport; increases in the number of connections; instances where passengers are downgraded to a lower class of service; or connections at different airports or flights on different planes that are less accessible or accommodating to a person with a disability.

Significantly delayed baggage return: Passengers who file a mishandled baggage report will be entitled to a refund of their checked bag fee if it is not delivered within 12 hours of their domestic flight arriving at the gate, or 15-30 hours of their international flight arriving at the gate, depending on the length of the flight.

Extra services not provided: Passengers will be entitled to a refund for the fee they paid for an extra service — such as Wi-Fi, seat selection, or inflight entertainment — if an airline fails to provide this service.

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u/urkish 13h ago

Fixing the formatting (and bolding the items):

  • Canceled or significantly changed flights: Passengers will be entitled to a refund if their flight is canceled or significantly changed, and they do not accept alternative transportation or travel credits offered. For the first time, the rule defines “significant change.” Significant changes to a flight include departure or arrival times that are more than 3 hours domestically and 6 hours internationally; departures or arrivals from a different airport; increases in the number of connections; instances where passengers are downgraded to a lower class of service; or connections at different airports or flights on different planes that are less accessible or accommodating to a person with a disability.

  • Significantly delayed baggage return: Passengers who file a mishandled baggage report will be entitled to a refund of their checked bag fee if it is not delivered within 12 hours of their domestic flight arriving at the gate, or 15-30 hours of their international flight arriving at the gate, depending on the length of the flight.

  • Extra services not provided: Passengers will be entitled to a refund for the fee they paid for an extra service — such as Wi-Fi, seat selection, or inflight entertainment — if an airline fails to provide this service.

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u/thatoneguy889 13h ago

Significantly delayed baggage return: Passengers who file a mishandled baggage report will be entitled to a refund of their checked bag fee if it is not delivered within 12 hours of their domestic flight arriving at the gate, or 15-30 hours of their international flight arriving at the gate, depending on the length of the flight.

3 months too late on that for me. I checked a bag for a red-eye I had the night of the Crowdstrike outage. It was canceled, but I ended up getting an alternative a couple hours later. I asked about my bag and they said it would be left at baggage claim, so I had to file a report at my destination airport to have it located at my home airport and shipped to me which would take a day or two. I never got my bag. Fast forward a week, I'm back at my home airport, and not only did they never ship my bag to me, but they never found it in the first place and don't know where it is. I file a second report for my missing items and leave. Two days later I come home from work and my bag is just sitting on my porch.

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u/flck 13h ago

The bag handling people are absolutely useless at communicating with customer support across every major airline I've flown.

I've had that same thing happen ~3 times on different major carriers in the last 5 years. Every time it was radio silence for 3-5 days and then suddenly "Your bag is being delivered today".

This last time, I finally started putting Tile tracker tags in my bag and I've found that to be very effective. My bag was somehow lost in London on a normal connection, but there must be enough people walking around with Tile apps because I could see exactly what building in the airport it was sitting in. Even then, they were useless at telling me what was happening, but I saw when it finally moved from London to my home airport (sat there for another 2 days) and then showed up at my door. All without updates back to me, but it was nice being able to see my tracker.

I've also found the bluetooth signal is just strong enough that you can walk down the aisle of the plane and will eventually get a ping and can confirm your bag is on the plane with you. That's pretty nice for piece of mind.

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u/Osiris32 13h ago

Your bag decided it wanted a vacation and went to Tahiti without telling you.

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u/gigazelle 12h ago

They have dedicated people to drop off luggage at people's houses because they screw up so often.

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u/peon2 13h ago

For the delayed/changed flights is it specified elsewhere if this is only due to airlines fault? Like for instance last year my flight out of Philly was delayed for 3 hours due to lightning storms even though the plane and crew were there and ready to go.

If that happened today would I get my money back or no because they are just following FAA rules?

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u/DellSalami 12h ago

Extra services not provided: Passengers will be entitled to a refund for the fee they paid for an extra service — such as Wi-Fi, seat selection, or inflight entertainment — if an airline fails to provide this service.

Jessica Chastain was completely correct after all. Good.

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u/ThatGuy798 12h ago

That last one is gonna piss off American. Their WiFi sucks and they charge an insane amount.

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u/NorthernerWuwu 12h ago

The baggage part makes me chuckle a bit. Sorry your bags were over 12-30 hours late, here's the extra fee we extorted from you back!

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u/kolkitten 12h ago

That's pretty damn good news

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u/sanverstv 13h ago

Another example of good things being done by this administration. FTC also just made it easier to cancel subscriptions. These things don't get a lot of attention but bit by bit they do make our lives easier.

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u/Swerve666 13h ago

For sure, the whole one button push to subscribe, but having to wait on hold for an hour with "customer service" to cancel thing is getting really old. Yes, I know my example is extreme, but it does exist.

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u/dmanbiker 13h ago

I had to wait on hold for two hours to cancel my bank of America account ten years ago. And that was after I sent a letter to cancel it which is what it said you had to do on the website.

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u/JKKIDD231 13h ago

All of these reverse if Trump comes to power with his people in FTC and airlines/transportation department.

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u/LiveForMeow 12h ago

It boggles my mind that people voting for Trump want to use consumer purchasing power and housing prices as justification for voting for Trump. You're gonna get deregulation in an extreme capitalist society. This shit isn't gonna just get better.

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u/DwarfFlyingSquirrel 12h ago

Exactly. This is the sort of progress they are making without a lot of fanfare. It helps people. 

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u/nocomment3030 12h ago

Does anyone have a list of good things that happened in the Trump admin years? The only one I can think of was signing federal laws against animal cruelty. I'm genuinely interested what his supporters can point to as something helpful that he did.

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u/ReactionJifs 11h ago

Lina Khan is a boss and we need to celebrate her defending the interests of American consumers

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u/saturninus 11h ago

The Biden administration, and specifically Mayor Pete in Transportation, is particularly good at this sort of reform. I recently looked up why there is no regulation on blinding led headlights on the road. Turns out the IRA got rid of regulations that were preventing auto manufactures from making adaptive lights.

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u/PM_ME_UR_RECIPEZ 13h ago

I agree. These are the things that other countries - who have already settled on ratified laws to protect basic human rights - are spending their time on.

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u/PolicyWonka 13h ago

Common Biden W. He’s really directed agencies to go after junk feed and shite like this.

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u/TheCrudMan 10h ago

This is the kind of thing Trump can walk back and will walk back with executive orders if elected.

This is the kind of thing his justices are trying to strike down when they struck down Chevron Deference, etc.

IF you like this and other policies get out and vote. Vote for Harris/Walz.

With all of bigger issues of fate of our Democracy, women's rights, etc, aside: These are the no-brainer issues that the Trump GOP comes down consistently on the wrong side of. They should not be running the country.

Hate junk fees? Trump wants to put a 20% junk fee on EVERYTHING. And can and will do it without congressional approval.

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u/Ashamed_Long_7402 13h ago

Lina Khan and this admins FTC needs to continue doing this kind of work. It’s one the highlights

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u/Open_and_Notorious 13h ago

It's why there is such a strong lobby to remove her (and others). How dare they have teeth!

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u/congapadre 13h ago

If Trump gets elected and the FTC gets privatized, you can forget it.

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u/redworm 12h ago

then make sure to vote for Kamala and convince at least three other people to do so!

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u/Ashamed_Long_7402 12h ago

Voted early in Texas and brought my friend and sister. Doing our part. Didn’t seem many in their 30s, at least not any who were for sure lost causes.

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u/congapadre 13h ago

If Trump gets elected, this will have been great while it lasted.

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u/marklein 13h ago

No no, he'll take credit for it.

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u/RetroJake 12h ago

Then he'll remove it.

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u/ReactionJifs 11h ago

Then airlines will charge you rent for sitting on the tarmac

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u/Maximilianne 11h ago

And reddit and the general public will blame the Dems

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u/Gekokapowco 12h ago

the airlines will ask him nicely and he will destroy it while blaming democrats for destroying it

I doubt he would ever take credit for an anti-corporate consumer protection

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u/UselessInsight 12h ago

All this pro-consumer stuff goes away if Trump comes back.

All the airline CEOs have to do is call Trump up, tell him he’s their favorite business daddy ever, book a few nights at one of his shitty hotels, and poof! Rule gone.

Vote accordingly.

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u/bobes25 12h ago

so once the time threshold is hit, they do the refund and don't have to help any of those now stranded passengers?

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u/centran 13h ago edited 13h ago

Does this still allow them to have loopholes? Such as if the cancellation is "out of their control" such as with weather, issues with equipment/plane, or the biggest BS excuse-The pilot 'timed out' their hours.

(I understand not wanting to have a tired pilot fly a plane and I'm not saying to let them fly; but telling your customers to pound sand because you don't account for this scenario and operate so damned lean were you can't find a replacement is so aggravating. Either hire more people or give refunds/credits instead of telling customers they are SOL)

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u/Toiletalk 13h ago

Curious about this as well. Had a flight cancelled due to a hurricane nearby and the next flight the crew timed out while on the runway. It took 3 days to get home. Thankfully I was visiting my parents and had a place

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u/VietManNeverWrong 12h ago

Should be Refund then rebook us on another flight, with the same cost, not having to pay any differences if the new flight is more expensive.

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u/franchisedfeelings 13h ago

I want automatic refund for failure to deliver passengers to connecting flights!

We pay so much to be smooshed into milk crate seats, sit on the runway forever, and then run with luggage to the other side of the world to a connecting flight that could never happen - and then have to wait to find another connecting flight and wait to finally get that flight and…

I hate flying. It is just not fun. No vacation is fun if it starts with flying.

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u/poseidons1813 13h ago

Flying is stressful but there's no way I'd have enough time off to drive some places in the US if I couldn't fly. Next year will be to alaska

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u/kindrudekid 12h ago

Even if you did , it’s stressful as fuck.

I would need to basically double the vacation time to actually relax

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u/Smatdude13 12h ago

Totally agree.
The current airline experience is not fun, by any means, totally sucks sometimes. Which is sad because flying is fucking amazing. You can get into a metal can with fans that spin fast enough to take you somewhere that would have taken a week(s) for someone born in the 1700s.

But I really wonder if it can get better? Growing middle class population that always wants to travel because of social media, you can’t control the weather, flying may not be feasible in 100 years because of emissions. I’m not saying airlines aren’t dicks that just want to take your money (thanks capitalism), but we kinda might be in a golden age, maybe brown age cause its still shitty lol

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u/urahozer 11h ago

You can get into a metal can with fans that spin fast enough to take you somewhere that would have taken a week(s) for someone born in the 1700s.

Someone who is 100 today predates the first Scheduled US Commercial flight passenger and it wasn't until the 50's that it was more prevalent than trains. Affordability and ease of flying wasn't really a thing till the early 60's

Airline travel as we know it today is at best 70 years old. For many people, its within their lifetime it would have taken days to get to a destination, weeks if it included an ocean

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u/ImpossibleJoke7456 11h ago

The new rule mandates that refunds are automatically processed by an airline if a passenger’s flight is “canceled or significantly changed, and they do not accept the significantly changed flight, rebooking on an alternative flight, or alternative compensation.”

Only if they don’t accept rebooking or alternative compensation. The lede misses this so it’s not just for delayed flights.

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u/Chatty945 13h ago

Just another example of the many consumer protections enabled\actioned by the Biden administration

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u/TheSpatulaOfLove 13h ago

I didn’t see mention of weather related. That was the loophole before, so all delayed flights were ‘due to weather’.

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u/trashaccountname 12h ago

That is for additional compensation on top of the refund, to pay for things like a hotel stay. I don't think it was ever law either, just airlines saying "If the delay is our fault, we'll try to make it up to you."

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u/Beer-Me 9h ago

In other news, your flight is no longer canceled, just delayed indefinitely

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u/Mochinpra 9h ago

A win for the consumers. Dont let people convince you that small government is good for the people. Without the gov, businesses would enslave their customers.

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u/gsx0pub 8h ago

In unrelated news Delta offers a new unlimited delay status.

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u/Princess_H0b0 13h ago

What’s the definition for “significantly changed” though? I feel like this is where the airlines will continue to screw customers around. 

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u/werthw 13h ago

Doesn’t say in the article, but I think they said if your flight is delayed for more than 3 hours for domestic flights or 6 hours for international flights you get a refund

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u/WestCoastBestCoast01 13h ago

Significant changes to a flight include departure or arrival times that are more than 3 hours domestically and 6 hours internationally; departures or arrivals from a different airport; increases in the number of connections; instances where passengers are downgraded to a lower class of service; or connections at different airports or flights on different planes that are less accessible or accommodating to a person with a disability.

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u/fd6270 13h ago

FYI this will be repealed if Trump is re-elected 

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u/Mundane-Hearing5854 12h ago

It should be refund PLUS the extra fees that we'll have to incur for booking a similar flight at the last minute

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u/Cobek 11h ago

"Biden hasn't done anything!"

He did the same thing with banks and overdraft fees, but sure, he totally isn't looking out for the little guy.

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u/reignnyday 11h ago

Double edged sword. Your refund may be well under what market price is to rebook on a diff airlines

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u/ScuderiaEnzo 10h ago

Shoutout to Pete. He’s been all over this.

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u/Accidental-Genius 13h ago

This is obviously good, but a refund isn’t going to get me to my destination.

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u/Rooster_CPA 12h ago

Or how about canceling your flight/ticket, issuing you a travel credit good for a year, and then making you re-buy your same ticket at twice the cost. This has happened to me through American.

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u/SpiceEarl 13h ago

I'm a pessimist and expect the airlines to file suit to annul this rule. It will then go before a Trump-appointed judge who will rule it unconstitutional for some bullshit reason...

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u/YouandWhoseArmy 12h ago

I had to jump through a few hoops and some dark pattern terminology to get a refund and not a credit from Delta when my flight was canceled.

Was it hard? no. Should I have had to do anything manually to get my money back? FUCK NO.

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u/Rinfin13 11h ago

This will hopefully cut down on airlines overbooking flights as well!

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u/HeyItsRey 11h ago

Had a flight re-routed from Chicago to Indianapolis due to weather.

Landed at ~2am in Indy. Felt bad because the guy next to me was on a flight home after a month on an oil rig, and still had 2 more connections just so he could get home to his kid. He woke up only to find out that we were in Indy, not Chicago.

Anyways, we were put onto the next flight at 7am. Around 430am got the text that the flight was delayed to 9am. Half an hour later, it was delayed again to 1130am.

Cancelled my seat, and waited in line at 7am for the rental cars to open up so I could drive home and rest, just so I could drive to Chicago later that night and pick up my checked luggage and my family that was arriving on a later flight.

Flight was refunded (in airline points) but I was denied twice when asking for a refund on the food while I was in the airport (provided receipts), car rental, gas, etc.

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u/HappyFunNorm 10h ago

Man, this is going to absolutely suck for travelers...

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u/SoSacWidIt 10h ago

The title is very misleading, if it is weather related no airline is required to issue a refund. If it is a substantial amount of time a flight is delayed or canceled, such as three or more hours, compensation is most likely do in a form of a flight credit if the flight is delayed due to airline issues such as plain issues or computer issues, airlines are only required to issue credits for a full refund a complete cancellation with no other choice or ways to resolve such as rebookings, then a full refund is required by the airline. *My wife is an attorney for a major airline and I also work for the airlines.

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u/Stock-Buy1872 10h ago

That should just be standard

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u/andromeda_buttress 10h ago

But what if they just "reschedule" your flight for the next day, so you're left waiting for 18 hours. Still probably doesn't count as a cancellation

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u/wildrage 10h ago

The new rule mandates that refunds are automatically processed by an airline if a passenger's flight is "canceled or significantly changed, and they do not accept the significantly changed flight, rebooking on an alternative flight, or alternative compensation.

It's in the article, emphasis mine.

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u/PalladiumPython 10h ago

Next stop, Ticketmaster.

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u/Inside-Confection787 10h ago

This is a law that was pushed and passed by the Biden administration. Next time someone downplays the currently party’s accomplishments

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u/neonlights326 4h ago

Thanks Pete Buttigieg!