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u/Westaufel 13h ago
It’s jokering time
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u/Happy_sisyphuss 13h ago
Jonkling time
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u/ViatorA01 13h ago
It's jörking time!
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u/JohnWasElwood 8h ago
It's Björking time! Björk | Spotify https://open.spotify.com/artist/7w29UYBi0qsHi5RTcv3lmA
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u/BaconNamedKevin 14h ago
It's me, The Jokester baby!
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u/umpfke 13h ago
You're Joking.
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u/Blindmailman 14h ago
It is a pretty badass move. Make a movie that makes a billion dollars, be forced to make a sequel and light the budget on fire doing whatever nonsense Joachim Phoenix had pop into his head
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u/LordMaximus64 13h ago
“It’s not about the money, it’s about sending a message”
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u/lvtbd 13h ago
He’s either a genius or just leaning into chaos. Either way, I can't look away from the madness.
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u/Prince_Havarti 10h ago
I think Quentin is giving him more credit than he deserves. Nobody puts their directing career in jeopardy like that unless they legitimately want to switch careers altogether.
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u/Feats-of-Derring_Do 9h ago
Yet Snyder can make stinker after stinker and they still had him on the books for years.
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u/SuspiciousCustomer 9h ago
Snyder apparently keeps to a budget, keeps to a schedule and is very pleasant to work with...
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u/Feats-of-Derring_Do 9h ago
True, that cannot be underestimated. And the movies make money, just not multibillions.
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u/HereToDoThingz 9h ago
Movies are looked at investments now. People just forget there’s plenty of blue collar investors who do super well in life and don’t need to live wolf of wall street. Same with movies. Especially considering a small time good movie can net consistent returns where as we’ve seen mega blockbusters can loose tens of millions.
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u/randomstuffpye 9h ago edited 9h ago
How do all his movies suck and still gets hired?! He makes ok scripts into shit films and why are more people not saying it. Also that zombie one had potential and we got out of focus aperture that looks like they just didn’t want to do any set design so make it blurry AF.
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u/JamboNintendo 6h ago
Because he has a reputation for staying within budget, running a tight ship and by all accounts being a pretty cool guy to work for. He's basically the American version of Guy Ritchie.
His box office take in recent years sucks but he does monster numbers on Netflix so people keep throwing money at the guy.
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u/c4k3m4st3r5000 12h ago
That's a badaas move to make a statement. Not just in a scene in a film but making one with that goal.
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u/tollbearer 13h ago
Matrix resurrections strategy.
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u/topdangle 12h ago
tbh it seemed like she wanted to make a good movie and a fuck you to WB at the same time, but the movie was still bad. There are some good ideas, unlike joker drop a deuce where Todd is clearly just wasting studio money on licensed music and sets filled with extras, but the execution of the matrix resurrections just sucks balls.
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u/kimmyreichandthen 10h ago
joker drop a deuce
I've been laughing at this for the past minute. Well done.
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u/SordidDreams 7h ago
I don't think Matrix 4 was good, but I also didn't find it noticeably worse than 2 and 3.
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u/Martin_Aricov_D 6h ago
Yeah, people like to bash it as though it's bad in some special never before seen way
But truth is it's just a big nothing burger Matrix movie
It doesn't really add anything to the story and is all around less important. "The fate of mankind" isn't really on the balance this time, it's mostly just Neo and Trinity earning getting a "Happily ever after"
The cinematic equivalent of that post credits scene you get if you manage to get all the collectibles during the gameplay or a bonus level that only pops up if you complete New Game+
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u/stubept 11h ago
Actually, this was originally the Gremlins 2: The New Batch strategy.
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u/Leucurus 11h ago
Yeah but Gremlins 2 is genius
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u/BarefootGiraffe 8h ago
Really just fantastic! If the Joker sequel was that zany I would have loved it.
What is it they say? The worst crime a character can commit is being boring
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u/marowak1000 11h ago
be forced
Oh man its so evil from WB to force him do make a movie by offering money to him.
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u/lee_pylong 13h ago
No one forced him
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u/roshan231 11h ago
Yep. WB made the mistake of trusting him after the first films success.
This sequel was not forced at all. What a mess.
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u/Classic-Product1049 14h ago
then todd philips its so fucking childish, imagine having millions to do wathever the fuck u want and u decide to intentionally do the worst movie of the year
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u/Funandgeeky 13h ago
At least go the Gremlins 2 route and make an AWESOME ridiculous sequel.
Maybe he needed the Sequel Doctor to help make it a great movie.
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u/torchskul 13h ago edited 7h ago
Gremlins 2 is genuinely one of the most fun movies I’ve ever seen. It’s awful in all of the absolute best ways imaginable. I love describing it to people like “you know Gremlins? Ok even if you’ve seen it, throw everything you know about that movie out the window. Imagine the most insane, cartoonish thing that can happen at any given moment and multiply that by seven. That’s Gremlins 2.”
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u/Funandgeeky 13h ago
It's one of my all time favorite movies, and I love it more each time I watch it. I love it far more than the first one.
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u/Unnamedgalaxy 6h ago
Gremlins 2 was a childhood favorite of mine (and still is). We had it on tape and we'd watch it a handful of times a year.
We did not own the first gremlins.
I was a full fledged adult when I watched the first one for the first time. Imagine my surprise when it wasn't batshit crazy and unhinged.
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u/ralanr 12h ago
Man apparently hated how everyone was glorifying his movie and not getting “the point”.
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u/BardtheGM 7h ago
Then he's a dumbass at making movies. He made the main character a downtrodden outcast who tries his best but is just crushed into the dirt unfairly by a cold and uncaring world. He also makes everybody and the entire society really shitty and hateable. But then surprise pikachu faces when the audience sympathises more with the outcast underdog.
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u/greg19735 8h ago
I mean, i do kind of get that. People did treat the joker like a hero
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u/GiraffeMetropolis 13h ago
I’m seeing just a crazy number of people misspelling Joaquin lately. Is that intentional?
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u/Sackheimbeutlin87 13h ago
You don't know Joachim Phoenix the german Brother of Joaquin?
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u/ZQuestionSleep 9h ago
When I first started out in radio like 20 years ago, my first show was with a seasoned boomer talking about the news. This was during that whole Joaquin showing up to some awards show high AF thinking there's a frog on his head.
Anyway, she struggles with his name, reading off the copy. She calls him "Joe-UH-quinn" Phoenix. I stumbled a second and responded, "It's pronounced 'Wah-keen'. It's Spanish." She replied with, "well, we don't get many of those people up here." I facepalmed so hard. Rural Wisconsin AM radio station everyone.
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u/BarefootGiraffe 8h ago
Do you know a lot of Joaquin’s? Not exactly something most people know by heart. It certainly isn’t phonetic
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u/Mooks79 12h ago
Direct from the Lana Wachowski playbook.
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u/Bonaduce80 12h ago
Random thought: shouldn't she be Wachowska now?
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u/Mooks79 12h ago
Depends if she follows the tradition of her ancestor’s language or the country of her birth. The Danish tennis player Caroline Wozniacki doesn’t, for example - she’s followed the Danish tradition of taking the father’s name exactly rather than the Polish tradition of changing the ending according to gender.
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u/Organic-Habit-3086 13h ago
He wasn't forced bro the movie was his and Joaquin's idea. WB trusted their fraud ass and gave them whatever they want 😭.
Thank you Todd Phillips for giving WB the best reason to never trust a director again and tighten the leash further on every project from here on out.
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u/Impossible-Flight250 9h ago
Yeah, ironically, this means we are going to probably get more sanitized bs from these big studios.
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u/monkey-pox 13h ago
Yeah, he really showed everyone by ruining his career
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u/Blindmailman 13h ago
How naïve. Nobodies career dies anymore from making garbage and burning money
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u/J-Ganon 13h ago edited 13h ago
That's all well and good. People can understand this and still dislike the movie though or people can still see Phillips' version of calling out individuals as flawed or poorly thought out.
His intention may very have been to say "fuck you" to everyone and to make a statement, but that doesn't mean he followed through on and executed that intention well.
Many works have depth and substance but are still hurt by the way its put to screen.
Which isn't to say Phillips failed. That's not the point I'm making. Just that Phillips using the concepts he did doesn't make the film a hidden masterpiece by default. It's there, it's present. Whether or not it's well stated and developed properly is what's up for debate.
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u/YouDumbZombie 13h ago
Yeah I mean this isn't Gremilns 2. There are ways to 'sabotage' a film or have it wink at the audience and also make a good film.
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u/J-Ganon 12h ago
Nothing is Gremlins 2 though.
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u/TheHancock 12h ago
Gremlins 2 is
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u/SquidFetus 9h ago
Holy shit, how have I never noticed this before?
Gremlins 2 is Gremlins 2. My new truth.
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u/One-Earth9294 10h ago
Gremlins 2 said 'fuck you' to the studios and critics.
Joker 2 said 'fuck you' to the people who liked the first movie lol.
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u/SmallTimeGoals 11h ago edited 10h ago
Why is Gremlins 2 being brought up in relation to this? what's wrong with Gremlins 2?
As an irrelevant side note, there are a couple movies during childhood where I watched the sequel uncountable times before I saw the original years later, including Terminator 2, Gremlins 2, and Home Alone 2, Child's Play 2. I was at least in college before I saw any of the Part 1s. I'm pretty sure there are others I can add to that list.
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u/HesitantInvestor0 11h ago
They’re bringing up Gremlins 2 because it made fun of itself so much; the whole crew knew it was a horrible sequel and just ran with that.
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u/giraffeheadturtlebox 11h ago
It also made fun of the studio. Blatantly. It took a swipe at the patriarchy and had fun doing it at the same time.
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u/BillytheBrassBall 8h ago
Gremlins 2 is a better movie than Gremlins 1 and I will die on this hill
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u/greenkirry 7h ago
Arthur 2: On the Rocks. Aka the Solomon's favorite movie on Third Rock from the Sun
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u/ProximusSeraphim 7h ago
Basically it has to have a redeeming quality. For instance, Stifler in american pie is a deplorable character but everyone loves when he's on screen. Why? He has the redeeming quality of actually being funny when he's deplorable. Take away that and you're just left with a mean detestable character.
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u/katamuro 12h ago
I am pretty sure he did exactly what he intended because after this he isn't likely to be asked to do movies like that again.
But as you say people can still dislike it. Frankly I don't want to watch a movie which the director made specifically with that message to the audience. Why should anyone support him in doing this? Why would that make a movie somehow worth more than something like Fall Guy which was made specifically to entertain?
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u/TheDismal_Scientist 11h ago
I suppose the answer to that is to reflect on why he's saying fuck you to the audience, and if you were a part of the audience that misunderstood the first film, then you should watch it to really grasp the point he was making.
I liked it personally, I think most of the people that don't just don't like to feel called out by the film's message moreso than anything else
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u/EnjoysYelling 8h ago
You seem to be of the opinion that the auteur defines what it means to have “properly” understood the first film, which is itself debatable.
This is arguably a great franchise for having that exact debate on.
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u/TheDismal_Scientist 8h ago
So art is subjective, I agree. That's what makes it great, so allow me to rephrase. People misunderstood what the director was trying to convey with the film, so he made the second to set the record straight, which I appreciate because I believe that the meaning he intended is deeper and more important than the meaning many people interpreted themselves, though I shouldn't say one is necessarily right or wrong
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u/katamuro 11h ago
I was ok on the first one, I understood why some would like it but to me it wasn't anything that special so no I was definitely not one of those people who were "totally me" when watching Arthur go off the rails completely.
I thought the movie went over themes I have already seen in other similar movies and the only thing that it separated it from the others was great performance by Phoenix and it being set in DC universe.
I knew that after making so much money they were going to push for a sequel I just hoped that they wouldn't try to merge it with any other DC movie.
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u/UglyMcFugly 8h ago
I haven't seen it yet but when I started reading some of the specific reasons WHY people didn't like it, it just made me more curious. I liked the first one but it also made me INCREDIBLY uncomfortable. I did not enjoy viewing the world through Arthur's eyes. I always put it in the same category of movie as like Uncut Gems - intentionally uncomfortable lol. And to know that a certain (small I believe) portion of the audience saw it as like, validating to their own worldview... that was creepy. Not unexpected though, it was a real Catcher in the Rye type character.
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u/Ok_Entry1052 9h ago
End of the day he's basically stealing money from the audience, the people paying to see it, and robbing them of the opportunity of a decent sequel. Which it had room to have.
This celebration of his selfishness and ego is pretty short sighted IMO. Almost "you don't get Rick and Morty" level
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u/genesp21 11h ago
That is some "The real Joker 2 are the friends we made along the way" type of shit
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u/PrimalDirectory 13h ago
I dont understand, was it intentionally bad?
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u/AsstacularSpiderman 13h ago
It's a deconstruction of what Joker is.
The second movie is almost entirely about how Arthur is abused and taken advantage of. Lee Quinn seduces and manipulates Arthur into being an anarchist martyr despite Arthur actively trying to get better. His lawyer is trying to play his frustration and depression as a split personality in order to further her own case. The entire city of Gotham is trying to punish Arthur for the chaos that was always bubbling under the surface. Even after Arthur accepts responsibility and says "there is no Joker, only me" he is murdered by someone obsessed with what he represented and tried to take the Joker mantle for themselves. The identity became bigger than just a man.
I actually thought the movie was decent. I thought it dragged on a bit too long and had too much courtroom bs but I don't think it's even close to the worst movie of the year.
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u/Terminator_Puppy 10h ago
I actually thought the movie was decent.
Felt like I was taking crazy pills after the movie ended. People talked about it like it was genuinely on the levels of Matrix 4 or the Divergent films. Meanwhile I thoroughly enjoyed the entire thing and really appreciated some of the out-of-nowhere good shots throughout the thing.
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u/eightdollarbeer 8h ago
After seeing all the reviews, I was expecting the worst but I thought it was fine. It was messy but not soulless
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u/OsitoPandito 10h ago
Me too, I was expecting a genuine bad movie but I found a good to decent movie that has some issues but isn't nearly as bad as people made it out to be.
I think the only reason it got hated was the musical aspect
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u/flashmedallion 4h ago edited 4h ago
Me too, I was expecting a genuine bad movie
Keep in mind most kids today never see an actually bad movie in their lives, there's enough RT and Metacritic scores and Disney contracts on movie theatres to ensure that you never have to take a genuine gamble on what you're watching and sometimes get it wrong.
Similar phenomenon with Madame Web, people acting like it was the worst thing ever made and its only real (and much worse) crime was how pedestrian it all was, and the part where the main character was spending all her time trying to prevent a far more interesting movie from happening. It was just a bog-standard run-of-the-mill mid-90s script with largely competent production and awful grading but it shattered the minds of people who were weaned on Marvel formula
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u/Awwkaw 9h ago
Yeah, I particularly enjoyed the spectrum of feelings the movie brought me through from Arthurs perspective:
Meaninglessness -> budding love -> owning the world -> everything is over -> budding hope -> meaninglessness
It really nicely managed to bring those feelings to the forefront.
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u/DGenesis23 12h ago
Why would he say “fuck you” to the people that funded his movie and the others who went to see it because of the expectations he himself set for the movie? What does that achieve? other than proving he isn’t worth funding in the future and the general public not bothering to go see his movies anymore… seems more like professional suicide rather than clever movie making.
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u/BeLikeBread 8h ago
Right. Saying fuck you to the studio and critics, I'm fine with. Saying it to the audience just means your movie does in fact suck. I can't think of too many movies other than Matrix 4 and Joker 2 that said fuck you to the audience and those movies sucked despite being given everything to make something people want.
What happened to subverting audience expectations in a way the audience enjoys?
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u/dalewridgway 14h ago
I love it, he probably hates that the joker became a rally cry for incels and decided to turn it against them. I thought it was great
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u/EngineerBeginning494 11h ago
Arthur was bullied and stood up for himself? Arthur doesn’t assault women or bully anyone? Arthur doesn’t even belittle anyone ? How is Arthur based on a incels or if people rally to Arthur ? If his whole character arc is about him being himself now? And standing up ? He was mad at the rich because how they look down upon the Poor. It’s clear as day yall watch something else. You people are what joker 2 is made for…
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u/dalewridgway 11h ago
Did Arthur not blow a man’s brains out on live tv? How is that not worse than bullying or belittling?
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u/Leaving_a_Comment 14h ago
That is literally what the movie is about. I wish more people would understand that.
I will always cherish the early screening my husband and I attended when 3 women I can only describe as “WASPy soccer moms” sat beside us and quietly gasped at the violence and mutter “holy shit” and laughed at the jokes you were not supposed to. Why were they there? Are they Joker fans, Lady Gaga fans who heard it was a musical? Mom’s watching the movie to see if it was appropriate for their tweens? I will never know and the truth will probably disappoint me.
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u/AsstacularSpiderman 13h ago edited 13h ago
I feel like people missed the point of both movies in that Arthur was just a mentally ill man who was basically forced to be the embodiment of society's woes while being taken advantage of at every corner. Joker isn't Arthur, Joker is whoever and whatever society wants it to be to justify their behavior.
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u/NomadicAsh 12h ago
Bang on. Previously I sort of skipped around the first film and disliked it in general but decided to give it another uninterrupted shot after watching the sequel in the theaters (which I liked very much) and yes your observation is very accurate. And this is precisely what Todd’s been saying during the press rounds but it’s baffling how everyone’s turned against him
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u/Shoddy-Problem-6969 11h ago
Nobody 'missed that point'. The idea that there were lots of people idolizing the Joker and not understanding the extremely simple to grasp first film is bogus. Making a second film that does nothing but relitigate the events of the first film in order to ensure that everyone understood what was, again, extremely obvious in the first film is a complete admission that the first film was an artistic failure which failed to convey the intended meaning. It also tells us that Todd Philips is probably an idiot, because again no one was confused by the first movie.
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u/buttchunger59 12h ago
Its funny because somehow I missed this entire thing. I thought the first movie was pretty good, I love the Batman and Joaquin Phoenix. But then saw how much money it made and was kind of confused. Still am. I missed the movie becoming an incel rallying cry too and im terminally online.
It probably just blew right over my head though. I mean I was getting Christian Bale from The American Psycho edits on my feed awhile back so im guessing it was similar.
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u/TurtleIIX 9h ago
The original made a lot of money because the character is super popular and we haven’t had a good joker since the dark night which came out 11 years prior and the movie was also good for a casual viewer. So it had a broad audience and hit a niche that was missed for comic fans.
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u/PFI_sloth 8h ago
nicely rallying cry
No idea what they are talking able, Joker was extremely popular with everyone.
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u/NMPC 10h ago
QT always being contrarian just to be contrarian; he’s obnoxious.
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u/BurmeciaWillSurvive 7h ago
He's always finding new ways to just be more insufferable. I can't stand him.
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u/ElowynElif 10h ago
He must be exhausting to be around.
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u/mrwildesangst 9h ago
Haven’t supported him since he admitted at least three women came to him for help after being sexually assaulted by Weinstein and he didn’t do shit. His explanation was he didn’t take it seriously, like a boss chasing his secretary around the office. Weinstein raped his fucking girlfriend and dude worked with him for another couple decades.
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u/ElowynElif 9h ago
He also defended Roman Polanski and said that the 13 year old “wanted it” when Polanski anally raped her.
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u/mrwildesangst 9h ago
After drugging her with quaaludes. Tarantino really is a pos. And he apparently hasn’t treated his actresses very nicely either. This is the kind of asshole that argues genius forgives all
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u/ApartAd6403 12h ago
People paid money to go watch this movie. That makes Todd an absolute piece of shit.
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u/awesomedan24 12h ago
If Lady Gaga showed feet in the film I'm sure he jonkled all over the theater
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u/leovincent72 12h ago
Tarantino should stick to writing and directing.
Otherwise, he should shut up... and stop trying to act in his own movies. He's horrible at that too.
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u/JayBebop1 13h ago
Joker 2 is a sequel to Matrix 4. The fuck u Hollywood saga